Ibaitik Itsasora
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A brief history of how Palestinians have resisted in Gaza | Norman Finkelstein | UNAPOLOGETIC
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pa426LEahfQ) Professor Norman Finkelstein briefly explains the awful conditions that Palestinians in Gaza have been subjected to by Israel, since being driven into Gaza in 1948 as refugees, and how since then they have exhausted diplomatic, political and humane resistance as a political strategy alongside seeking liberation through armed struggle.
Transkripzioa:
0:00
Hamas
0:01
cooperated it cooperated that’s a
0:06
fact and what did they get out of the
0:09
cooperation they got reports which were
0:12
never acted on try to give us a sense of
0:15
because I mean there is I think a lot of
0:18
our viewers would know that because a
0:19
lot of our viewers obviously are we we
0:21
cover Palestine extensively and so um a
0:24
lot of them would be aware but just give
0:26
us a sense of how Israel
0:30
sort of changed played the victim card
0:33
and and and has worked so hard to kind
0:36
of push the Palestinians into this point
0:39
where October 7th happened because
0:42
obviously it’s been it’s been a long
0:43
journey for Palestinians and Palestinian
0:45
resistance and I think there’s often an
0:46
impression that you know the resistance
0:49
is just a bit mindless and I’m sure the
0:51
resistance is flawed because they
0:52
operate in a very difficult environment
0:54
but um just just kind of like you know
0:57
speak to that
1:00
well you put a severe limitation on me
1:05
you okay be be be a bit brief not too
1:08
brief that’s that’s like a death
1:11
sentence
1:13
um where does one begin I think the best
1:16
place to begin people can disagree
1:18
obviously I think the best place to
1:20
begin is
1:22
1948 and the for 1948 represents the
1:26
climax of a project that began at the
1:28
end of the 19 Century the climaxes the
1:32
formation of the state of Israel in the
1:35
course of Israel’s
1:37
formation about 90% of the population of
1:41
what became Israel is
1:43
expelled it’s about the rough estimates
1:45
or about
1:47
750,000 Palestinians are expelled of
1:50
those
1:52
750,000 approximately 270,000
1:56
300,000 end up in
1:58
Gaza and
2:00
so that’s the first fact that we have to
2:02
always bear in mind that Gaza is
2:05
overwhelmingly a refugee population
2:08
refugees and their
2:10
descendants who under international law
2:13
The Descendants are also classified as
2:17
refugees Gaza is also overwhelmingly a
2:20
child population it’s about 48%
2:24
children now again I’m often accused I
2:29
believe
2:30
incorrectly of being extreme in my
2:34
language or of being exagger
2:38
exaggerating in my
2:40
language so I will refer to what others
2:45
have said one of the Striking things
2:47
when you go back to the beginning of the
2:50
creation of Gaza we know it is that one
2:55
outside Observer after another one after
2:59
another
3:00
they routinely refer to Gaza as a
3:03
concentration
3:04
camp now that’s not
3:07
me and it’s not as if memories of World
3:11
War
3:12
II have been uh obscured we’re talking
3:17
about right after
3:18
1948 so you talk about the
3:21
chief uh un representative in Gaza his
3:25
name is Elm
3:26
Burns and he writes a memoir
3:30
and he says well there’s not starvation
3:33
that’s in the streets you don’t see
3:34
starvation in the streets but he said
3:38
Gaza has a huge concentration camp on
3:40
the sand that’s what it
3:42
is by the way
3:46
Israelis in all sectors of Israeli life
3:52
refer to Gaza under Egyptian
3:55
Administration we’re talking about
3:57
between 1950 and 19 67 when it’s under
4:01
Egyptian
4:03
Administration Burns calls of the
4:05
Concentration Camp the
4:07
Israelis keep referring to it as a
4:10
concentration
4:12
camp then in
4:14
1967 in
4:17
July uh the father of Al Gore alore
4:21
people remember as the American who ran
4:24
for president in
4:25
2000 his father was also a senator he
4:29
goes to Gaza he comes back reports now
4:34
it’s under Israeli rule it’s after 67 he
4:37
comes back he reports to Congress and he
4:41
refers to Gaza as a concentration
4:46
camp then in
4:49
2002 a senior Israeli
4:53
sociologist baru
4:55
Kimberling he writes a book on the
5:00
uh on the uh the occupation when Ariel
5:05
Chiron was the Prime
5:06
Minister he describes gaza’s quote the
5:10
biggest concentration camp ever in
5:14
2004 the then head of the National
5:17
Security Council G island who’s still
5:21
around he’s playing a a
5:23
most
5:25
uh nefarious role the past 15 months
5:30
during the Israeli oper uh genocide in
5:32
Gaza how did he describe Gaza quote the
5:37
head of the Israeli National Security
5:39
Council describes as quote a huge
5:42
concentration
5:44
camp that was Gaza
5:47
now in
5:50
2006 Hamas wins the Parliamentary
5:53
elections the Parliamentary elections
5:55
incidentally which President Bush
5:58
demanded it was the era of what was
6:00
called democracy promotion after the uh
6:04
Israeli us attack on
6:07
Iraq and they uh they impose the uh uh
6:13
they demand elections Hamas doesn’t want
6:16
to
6:16
participate because it says this is part
6:19
of the Oslo process what began in 1993
6:22
we won’t have anything to do with AO
6:24
process we don’t have anything to do
6:25
with these elections it’s all a facade
6:28
for Israeli
6:30
control well they’re finally persuaded
6:34
to participate in the
6:36
elections and lo an elections according
6:38
to Jimmy Carter the American president
6:41
who just passed away he described the
6:44
elections as completely honest and fair
6:47
and lo and behold Hamas
6:50
wins immediately as it wins elections
6:53
which the US government
6:56
demanded immediately as Hamas WI
7:00
Israel poses this brutal economic
7:02
blockade on Gaza and then Israel is
7:06
followed by uh the United States and the
7:10
EU European
7:12
union and now at this point Hamas
7:18
engages because it’s an elected
7:20
government and it was
7:23
elected on the hopes it ran on what was
7:26
called a reform platform
7:29
and had to deliver on its
7:31
platform otherwise it’s going to be
7:33
voted
7:34
out and
7:36
so the first order of business has to be
7:40
to end this blockade which everybody
7:43
agrees is destroying Gaza and it tried
7:47
many things first of all it tried
7:50
diplomacy it was sending
7:52
signals which were
7:54
acknowledged by US government
7:57
agencies it was sing signals that was
8:00
prefer prep prepared to end to terminate
8:04
the conflict on the basis of
8:06
international law namely two states
8:09
along the June 1967 border now I will
8:14
admit no point
8:15
in I have a CREDO in life never quarrel
8:18
with
8:19
facts I’m not going to dispute there
8:22
were gray areas in hamas’s
8:26
response Hamas was formerly committed to
8:31
the exercise of the full right of Return
8:34
of the
8:35
refugees now under international law
8:37
they have a very strong
8:39
case they have a very strong case under
8:42
international law that refugees have a
8:44
right of
8:45
return but as a practical matter I don’t
8:48
believe it’s realistic I don’t want to
8:50
go into the get into this I’m just
8:53
saying I will
8:55
acknowledge
8:56
that uh the Hamas response was not
9:00
perfect but it certainly was
9:03
serious and they were they had a f real
9:05
dilemma you have to remember 80 70% of
9:09
gaza’s
9:10
refugees so they couldn’t very easily
9:12
give up that right of
9:15
return that’s their
9:19
constituency uh but all of their
9:22
attempts to resolve the conflict
9:25
diplomatically were ignored they were
9:27
simply ignored
9:30
then they tried international law here
9:32
is a little known
9:35
fact as I mentioned in earlier there
9:39
were these commissions of inquiry after
9:41
each of
9:42
Israel’s uh Horrors in Gaza now the
9:48
commissions of inquiry were not soft on
9:51
Hamas not at all they accused Hamas of
9:55
war
9:56
crimes of serious war crimes
10:01
okay Hamas cooperated with the
10:04
commissions of
10:05
inquiry it
10:07
knew it
10:09
knew that the final reports of these
10:14
commissions of inquiry
10:18
would uh come to a very harsh judgment
10:21
on
10:22
Hamas indeed accusing them of war crimes
10:27
that didn’t deter them
10:30
because they
10:32
believed that maybe even as they’re
10:35
accused of war
10:37
crimes they would get some justice
10:41
because Israel also would be held to
10:43
account which is what Richard Goldstone
10:46
did and the others
10:47
did what came of what what came of
10:51
it all these
10:54
reports
10:55
and they were put in the desk drawer
10:59
to collect
11:01
dust they tried remember Israel refused
11:04
to cooperate with any of the commissions
11:06
of inquiry refused up until today you
11:09
know the na’vi P Commission of inquiry
11:12
they say no they’re not going to
11:13
cooperate Richard Goldstone they say no
11:16
we’re not going to cooperate Mary
11:18
McGowan Davis after operation protective
11:20
Edge no we won’t cooperate Hamas
11:24
cooperated it cooperated that’s a fact
11:30
and what did they get out of the
11:32
cooperation they got reports which were
11:35
never acted on they just collected
11:39
dust and then they tried nonviolent
11:43
civil
11:44
resistance in March 2018 the great March
11:48
of return they tried nonviolent civil
11:52
resistance what came of that we know
11:54
exactly what came of it there was a 250
11:56
page Commission of inquiry report
12:00
and you know what the inquiry found it
12:02
quote Israel saying that they lined up
12:06
their best
12:07
snipers along the perimeter fence with
12:11
Gaza the Israelis said every bullet
12:17
fired hit its Mark that’s what they said
12:21
every bullet fired by these top snipers
12:25
hit their Mark who did they target
12:29
the UN 250 page single space report said
12:34
they targeted
12:36
children
12:38
journalists
12:39
Medics disabled people double
12:43
amputees who are 100 to 300 MERS away
12:48
from the perimeter fence and engaging in
12:52
strictly civilian
12:55
activities when they didn’t kill
13:00
the nonviolent
13:02
demonstrators they targeted their
13:05
kneecap and
13:07
below in order to
13:10
inflict
13:11
lifechanging
13:14
injuries so the documentary record shows
13:18
they tried
13:19
diplomacy they tried law they Tred
13:23
nonviolent s
13:26
resistance and on the night of October
13:33
6th it looked Gaza had vanished from the
13:37
news I
13:39
know because I abandoned
13:43
Gaza I gave up after chronicling it in
13:49
minute
13:50
detail for more than a
13:54
decade I reached the conclusion this is
13:57
pointless it’s worth
13:59
it’s
14:00
hopeless time to move
14:03
on I wasn’t proud of that decision there
14:08
was an element of
14:11
shame in that decision but I made
14:15
it and it looked as if the Abraham
14:20
Accords would extend to Saudi
14:24
Arabia and the people of
14:27
Gaza would be
14:30
left to die in that concentration
14:35
camp the younger
14:37
men who burst the gates of
14:41
Gaza on October 7th they were all around
14:46
20 they were born
14:49
into they languished
14:52
in and they died they were destined they
14:56
were f
14:59
to die in that concentration camp with
15:04
the only break in the
15:09
monotony of getting up each
15:12
morning and pacing the perimeter of Gaza
15:16
because 60% of them were unemployed the
15:20
young men 60% were unemployed the only
15:23
break in the
15:26
monotony of their existence
15:30
was the periodic Hightech Killing Spree
15:36
Israel’s mowings of the lawn in
15:40
Gaza
15:42
and they were born into they languished
15:46
in and as of October 6th they had been
15:52
abandoned by the whole of
15:56
humanity without
16:00
exception
16:03
and they were destined to die
16:07
there those who want to criticize them
16:11
in my opinion they have to first show me
16:16
what option did they have that they
16:21
didn’t exploit
oooooo
Palestinians would defiantly “die here and not leave”| Mustafa Barghouti | UNAPOLOGETIC
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oo0kaFnbdw)
In this extended interview, Mustafa Barghouti, general secretary of the Palestinian National Initiative, reacts to the statements and plans and remarks of U.S. President Donald Trump, who has made it clear that his intention is for the U.S to “have” Gaza and to clear out the Palestinians so that it can be rebuilt. Barghouti also speaks about how Israel has stepped up attacks on the West Bank, and how ethnic cleansing there has accelerated. He draws on the history of the conflict to show how Israel has always intended to ethnically cleanse historical Palestine completely. Despite this, Mustafa Barghouti remains defiant and says that Palestinians would rather “die”, than be forced to leave their homelands, again. Hosted by Ashfaaq Carim
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
01:55 reaction to Trump and King Abdullah presser
11:45 What do you know of the Arab response?
18:30 Gaza’s defiance
27:00 West Bank and prisoners
33:45 How much legitimacy has the PA lost? 3
8:15 Palestinian liberation connected to greater Arab liberation
42:00 Is there an ally in the new Syria?
45:30 Do you fear for your own life, final thoughts
Trranskripzioa:
Intro
0:00
uh and somebody has to tell it in his face I mean because I think diplomatic words here are not sufficient how could
0:07
anybody say that like what would have been his reaction if we said we want to
0:13
come in and take over New York and send all the people of New York to Afghanistan I say this with a very heavy
0:19
heart and you probably hear this with even a a more heavy heart but how exactly can the Palestinians now
0:27
especially in Gaza but also in the West Bank it’s very simple it’s very simple I’ll answer you if it reaches that
0:35
point we will die here and not leave it’s as simple as that I apologize
0:42
in advance I have a slight flu so I may cough from time to time no problem do it
0:49
it’s a good thing you’re not yell guess you have to clear your
0:54
throat hi good day and welcome to another episode of unapologetic today I’m joined by Dr Mustafa Alti Dr Mustafa
1:02
buti how are you doing fine thank you good to be with you good to be with you again this is the second time you appearing on our show and obviously I
1:08
don’t think you need any introduction but I’ll introduce you anyway you are the the General Secretary of the pni the
1:14
Palestine National initiative and I think over the last year especially since October 7th one of a very clear
1:21
loud moral defiant voice for Palestinians appearing regularly in the
1:26
media um so welcome on the show thank you thank you I appreciate that um it’s
1:31
an interesting time that you I mean it’s been an interesting time if I called you at any point in the last 16 months but
1:37
um I mean right especially today um I think we’re almost 24 hours since uh
1:42
Trump met with u had a press conference with King Abdullah of Jordan a few days before that he met with Netanyahu um
1:49
there’s all sorts of outrageous things being said about Palestine about Gaza um
1:54
this follows outrageous things and completely inhumane things that happened to Palestinians and still are still
2:00
happening to Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank just what do you make of everything that’s going on right now I’m
2:06
not going to go into the details of what those things I’ll feel free to go into that but we’ll we’ll hone in on the question later on but just as things
2:13
stand and everything that’s being said um what do you make of everything that’s going on what I make is that we are in
2:20
front of a very serious and dangerous conspiracy against the Palestinian
2:26
people a conspiracy that is led by the International Zionist
2:32
movement with Israel of course in the Forefront and a movement that has
2:38
managed to get an alliance with the fanatic Evangel
2:44
evangelic uh people in the United States and it is clear they are in control of
2:51
what’s happening in the American Administration including the president and uh what they are trying to achieve
2:59
is is nothing but uh a complete elimination and
3:05
uh liquidation of the Palestinian rights and the Palestinian cause and the Palestinian people as people uh we are
3:13
talking about uh movement that is trying to commit another uh genocide another
3:21
ethnic cleansing against the Palestinian people another nakba if I might say so
3:28
uh by speaking frankly and openly about uh terrible war crimes like ethnic
3:34
cleansing of all the people of Gaza uh and by talking about the annexation of
3:40
the West Bank so this is an a a settler Colonial
3:46
project that started in the beginning of or the end of the 19th century
3:54
achieved big part of its goal in 1948 when it displaced 70% % of the
4:00
Palestinian people and took over 82% of the land of historic Palestine and then
4:06
completed the issue with the the occupation of the remaining of Palestine
4:12
and now they want to conduct the second stage of ethnic cleansing of Palestinian
4:17
people this is this is what we deal with in my opinion this is the reality of the actual conspiracy we are subjected to
4:25
okay so just just going to I mean I’m sure you saw you saw parts of if not the whole press conference with King Abdullah and Trump yesterday um Donald
4:32
Trump was using words like we will have it like like as if though it’s not even the Americans will just take it um it’s
4:38
ours we will we will build it there we will look after it and cherish it he said that at one point um and I mean I
4:45
think at least from maybe I’m interpreting this incorrectly but King Abdullah did look uncomfortable um he
4:53
when he was asked by journalist he said we are waiting for an Egyptian plan there are some other Arab countries also making a plan he has a meeting in RI
5:00
um clearly trying to buy time but not trying to insult Trump at the same time um what is your interpretation of his
5:07
reaction and just are you privy of of any plan that’s been been drawn up in in
5:12
Arab capitals As He suggests um and what do you think’s going to come of that
5:17
well before we speak about the Arab reaction let’s talk about or let’s specify exactly what Trump is
5:25
saying uh and somebody has to tell it in his face I mean because I think diplomatic words here are not
5:32
sufficient uh what president Trump is saying is that he is committed to three
5:38
war crimes the war crime of ethnic cleansing of all the Palestinians out of in Gaza
5:46
to kick them out of their Homeland uh to ethnically cleanse 70% of
5:52
them the second time after they’ve been ethnically cleansed in
5:57
1948 and this is a war crime by international law the second crime he is
6:03
committed to is the annexation of the West Bank to Israel he never said that clearly as he did during the press
6:10
conference with King Abdullah when he was asked about Israel’s annexation of
6:15
the West Bank he said yes it will happen that is another War crime the
6:23
third war crime is the act of theft of another country stealing it from its
6:29
people the people of Gaza saying that he will take over the land by which law I mean
6:36
how could anybody say that like what would have been his reaction if we said
6:42
we want to come in and take over New York and send all the people of New York to Afghanistan I mean this is
6:50
a this is a terrible thing to be said yet it is said and clearly and openly by
6:56
the president of the largest uh Power in the world and what does that mean that
7:03
means and in my opinion Gaza has exposed this fact to the world that means we
7:09
don’t live by international law anymore and that will have very serious
7:14
implications to everybody in this world but also it means that the United States
7:19
of America and Israel are above the law and above international law and it also
7:25
means that Palestinians are not accepted as equal human beings to Jewish people to Israelis to Americans or to any other
7:33
people this is horrible but that’s exactly what is happening and during
7:40
that press conference ER of course the King was not comfortable because he doesn’t agree with Trump he knows that
7:48
displacement of Palestinians to Jordan would mean two things first of all it will create huge political problem for
7:54
the king because his people are totally against it but more than that it will
8:00
change the demography of Jordan that Jordan will stop being Jordan and that’s exactly what what Netanyahu is after and
8:08
that’s that was used to be the propaganda of shon who used to say Jordan is the Palestinian State and it
8:15
fits very well with what Netanyahu wrote in his book a place under the sun in 1995 when he said that when balford
8:22
Declaration was issued it promised Israel not only Palestine but also
8:28
Jordan and uh Jordan didn’t exist as he said and
8:35
so if Palestinians go to Jordan this this would be their country so in
8:42
reality we are talking here about something very dangerous for Jordan that is unacceptable to us too and uh in my
8:50
opinion the king tried to use an intelligent way of avoiding the issue by
8:55
talking about accepting 2,000 children that needs cancer need cancer treatment
9:01
which is totally different from what Trump is talking about and uh it seems
9:06
that he was surprised there was that there was media in the room suddenly because this was not agreed about in the
9:12
protocol but nevertheless I think the Arab countries have to get together now
9:17
they shouldn’t leave Jordan or Egypt alone they shouldn’t leave Palestinians alone as we were left during all this
9:24
war and uh that means in my opinion all Arab countries must get together
9:30
and this and say do three things first of all send a very clear message on behalf of all Arab and Muslim countries
9:36
the 56 countries that his plan is totally unacceptable and rejected and
9:42
and that these countries will stand against it Trump doesn’t understand that
9:48
diplomatic language he needs to hear it clearly and loudly and uh as a person
9:54
who is used to bullying people he can Retreat if he feels that there is a
9:59
serious push back that’s one second I think these countries have to create a
10:06
safety net for Palestinians to help them stead fast and stay on their land and to
10:11
provide support to the Reconstruction of Gaza so neither Netanyahu or Trump or
10:17
anybody else will ever have the dream that he can displace Palestinians from there but finally I think this should
10:23
establish a safety nit for Jordan and Egypt if Trump tries to play the game of
10:29
blackmailing these two countries uh by cutting the financial support he’s
10:34
giving it to them I think there should be an Arab safety net to help them uh
10:39
this is the way you can tell Trump to retreat and uh you can send him a
10:46
serious message about uh rejecting his plans okay I just want to I mean we want
10:51
to go I want to go back into what possibly is being discussed between Jordan Egypt Saudi Arabia and others but
10:58
before that and and I mean I remember sitting with you almost a year ago now when we were discussing hypothetically
11:04
when Netanyahu and it was at the time also being occasionally flouted by by by blinkin who eventually walked it back
11:10
that some of the Palestinians need to move from Gaza into Sinai and you mentioned that Palestinians they would
11:15
not have have a have any any would it would be another Gaza essentially um maybe not what Gaza is now but what Gaza
11:22
was then it would not have much rights and there would still be refugees um but I mean the idea is this was flouted
11:28
initially a long time ago as soon as this war almost began and it’s clear that when blinkin was making diplomatic
11:34
calls to Arab capitals he saw there’s no appetite for this hence it was walked back um it’s also been clear that since
11:40
Trump has been making these indications and saying it uh I mean suddenly Saudi
11:46
Arabia has found a voice uh you know more a voice that we kind of reminds us
11:51
of the Saudis of the ’90s and early 2000s where it was very clearly behind the establishment of a Palestinian State
11:57
um it has been rejected verbally um not last not yesterday by by King Abdullah while sitting next to Trump but
12:03
by almost every on every other instance by by Arab spokesman um in the last two weeks which is again a positive sign um
12:11
so just contextualizing all of that what do you think I mean you’ve said what you hope is the the the Arab response will
12:18
be but what do you know of what the response is um are you involved in any of the back channeling to to them um and
12:25
and how can they sort of I mean it’s one thing for them to do is their only option being defiant as you mentioned
12:31
and and saying that they reject this completely um will they be sort of strong arm something just how do you see
12:37
this playing out well first of all let me say that
12:42
the original plan of the Israeli attack on Gaza was specifically the ethnic cleansing the main goal was ethnic
12:49
cleansing and Natan did not hide that and he spoke about it in the very first
12:55
days of this uh terrible war and uh that’s what uh his Minister spoke about
13:00
Galant and others and Biden reported that before he left his uh position as
13:07
president of the United States in a late interview he said that uh Netanyahu
13:14
surprised him on the eighth day and told him that his plan is to evict everybody to Sinai and when Biden told him this is
13:22
unacceptable and and and he said he will smash Gaza to Earth and uh when Biden
13:28
told him that this is this might not be acceptable Netanyahu responded by saying
13:34
why did you then the United States of America used nucle nuclear bombs in Hiroshima and nagazaki and what did you
13:41
do to Germany in the second world war and then Biden told him but that was
13:47
before we had United Nations and international law and so on but anyhow
13:52
not that Biden did anything to stop him on the contrary Biden became a participant in the genocide but
14:00
today uh the the goal is to fulfill with political Maneuvers and American
14:06
pressure what Israel failed to achieve by military operation uh now I do not think any Arab
14:15
country can in any way support these plans of ethnic cleansing but I also know that some of
14:23
these countries will not do anything for us that’s well known and uh if there was
14:30
to be a serious reaction that would send a powerful message to Israel it would
14:35
have been the cancellation of all normalization agreements with Israel including Abraham
14:41
Accords uh and that would send a very powerful message to Israel I think the Saudis now are very
14:48
clear that don’t dream of normalization uh as long as you have
14:53
these plans of ethnic cleansing or and uh I think they’ve been consistent
14:59
consistent with their messages all the time although foreign journalist and
15:04
American journalist in particular tried to always read what was not written by the Saudis the Saudis are saying very
15:11
clearly that uh we have the Arab peace initiative there will be no normalization without solving the
15:17
Palestinian issue so that’s an important message and it shows that Trump is not
15:23
running a policy lots of full of contradictions from one side he wants
15:29
normalization but from the other side he wants to create ethnic cleansing of the Palestinian people these two things
15:35
cannot fit together and uh I hope I mean so far we’ve seen very strong even much
15:42
stronger reaction from Egypt and uh obviously that CCE cancelled his visit
15:49
to the United States mainly because of this issue because he didn’t want to be in the same situation as King Abdullah
15:56
was so the only way the Arab countries can push back effectively is to be
16:04
together and that’s what uh what the Jordanian king tried to allude to by by
16:10
saying there will be a joint Arab reaction but it has to be blunt and it has to be strong and it has to be clear
16:17
and shouldn’t use dipl too much diplomatic words of course it can be polite but at the same time decisive
16:25
that there is no way that anybody would accept ethnic cing of the Palestinian people from Gaza by the way uh what what
16:34
Trump wants is that the Arab countries not only accept ethnic cleansing but also to pay for it he wants Arab
16:41
countries to pay for relocation of Palestinian people imagine I mean how
16:47
far he has gone in in his arrogance and his ignorance of the Arab of the Palestinian
16:55
people history first and of of the of the geopolitical facts of the
17:01
region um I mean you know as well as anyone and a lot better than me that um
17:07
there’s the the Israeli habit uh conniving habit of creating facts on the ground and a reality so for example and
17:14
you clear it you very pointed out in this interview um even when when Biden thought the idea of of ethnically
17:19
cleansing Gaza what outrageous he provided the bombs and and Netanyahu continued a policy of making making Gaza
17:26
unlivable to the point where now I can I mean I guess for someone who is sitting outside of this recognizing that there’s
17:34
definite ethnic cleansing going on at the same time if Gaza is not rebuilt um
17:39
and it’s unlikely unless a lot of pressure is put on Israel that they will they will and I don’t I do not see why
17:45
Israel would want it to be rebuilt in any substantial way um I mean just what
17:51
are the options and secondly the to me the most dangerous thing about Trump
17:57
statements aren’t aren’t its it’s overt you know craziness and it’s overt
18:02
utterances of crimes but the fact that it will now give Netanyahu because when he didn’t have when he didn’t have that
18:08
overhead permission he he underwent a project whereby he could make Gaz Gaza unlivable he’s already begun uh for the
18:16
last year and even before that annexation of the West Bank has already been in place for a long time even before October 7th so how
18:23
does that’s going to continue right Netanyahu is going to accelerate his
18:28
ethnic cleansing of the entire Palestine both West Bank and the Gaza most likely so how does this actually impact the the
18:35
facts on the ground and and what form of resistance uh diplomatic resistance other resistance how can Palestinians
18:42
now resist this um what what options do you have before I joined your talk now I was
18:50
talking to our people in Gaza and maybe you know we have about 80
18:56
Medical Teams working there and providing Medical Care to 200,000 people
19:01
every month and they’re everywhere in the North in the center in the South you know what they were telling me
19:07
they were telling me this time they were in the South some of them were in the South because they were forced out from
19:15
the north to the South and then now they came back they told me today that in if if
19:22
anything happens again if the war happens again nobody will force us even to go to the South we will die here and
19:30
not leave and that’s the spirit that is uh
19:36
that is dominating as an an unbelievable amount of
19:41
resilience of course life is difficult but they are trying to rebuild with
19:47
everything they have I am so amazed about how many structures they have
19:53
reactivated with very little resources uh
19:59
I would I don’t think it’s appropriate to me to start telling you how much I am
20:05
proud of our people who I consider really heroes in Gaza but uh the reality is that the
20:13
people are after what they what has happened to them after this terrible injury after losing 10% of the
20:19
population of Gaza who were either killed or injured nobody didn’t lose any
20:24
somebody so they have horrible scars but that
20:30
made them even more determined more determined than ever not to leave Gaza
20:37
so they could try what they want but I do not think they will break the people of Gaza no way what we need as
20:46
Palestinians whether in the West Bank or or Gaza is three things three words
20:52
resilience resistance and steadfastness these are the three key
20:58
words that will guarantee our future as people and guarantee us getting the
21:04
freedom eventually uh and uh of course Natan is
21:10
trying to create facts on the ground his dilemma his biggest dilemma is the are
21:15
the facts of the ground that we have established including a very vibrant Palestinian Society including the fact
21:23
that we stayed in our land regardless of the dismissal of half of our people in
21:31
1948 uh the number of Palestinians on the land of historic Palestine now is 7.3 million versus 7.1 million Jewish
21:39
Israelis maybe this is even less because some some of them left during the
21:44
war and the only possibility is two solution either two State solution which
21:51
Israel rejects or one Democratic state which we would prefer and Israel also
21:56
rejects So What Remain for them the solution is ethnic cleansing and of course we will not
22:03
allow that so yes our situation is difficult we would have anticipated a
22:10
bigger support from our brothers in the different Arab and Muslim countries but that should
22:16
happen uh but whether it happens or doesn’t happen What Palestinians have learned in
22:22
their history is the very big value of self-reliance and at the end of the day
22:28
Netanyahu can try to do whatever he wants the big question here is whether Palestinians will be broken or they will
22:35
continue to resist his plans I think resistance will be the case I mean I I
22:43
hear everything you’re saying it I can hear the Defiance in your voice we’ve all seen defiant images from the
22:48
Palestinians um I mean even before the genocide the existence in the land as
22:53
you mentioned was defiant um and it’s very admirable it’s very courageous um
22:59
but I how long is it going to be sustainable um Trump and Netanyahu have
23:05
already said that on Saturday if more hostages are not being released or if all of them are not being released the
23:10
ceasefire will go I think both of us would probably acknowledge that the ceasefire was always a kind of a red herring that obviously provides a sense
23:17
of relief for the people but it was always a tactic for for them to continue their plan of trying to ethnically
23:23
cleanse or get as much of of of Palestinian land or deter the Palestinian struggle as much as possible
23:28
POS um so outside of the Defiance and the fact
23:35
that people will try to BU their lives out of rubble um and hoping that there’ll be a United stance verbally
23:42
from Arab and Muslim countries which even then may not actually materialize it may materialize in slowing down uh
23:48
any move of of evacuating and building a place where Palestinians can go to
23:53
whatever that conditions may be like um but what really real istic options are
23:59
there and I and I don’t say this I say this with a very heavy heart and you probably hear this with even a more
24:05
heavy heart but how exactly can the Palestinians now
24:10
especially in Gaza but also in the West Bank it’s very simple it’s very simple I’ll answer you if it reaches that
24:18
point we will die here and not leave it’s as simple as
24:24
that and let me remind you of many other situations before in people’s
24:32
history where the key point was not to give
24:38
up when France was occupied by Germany by the way it took the Germans only four
24:46
to six weeks I think to occupy all of France it took the Israelis 15 months to
24:51
break the Palestinian resistance in Gaza and they are they couldn’t up till now and uh
24:59
although the balance of power is is very different actually I think the French army was much bigger than the
25:04
Palestinian resistance but when France was broken
25:10
the the goal of the occupier is to break the will of the people and there were people who lost their faith and and were
25:18
broken like uh the head of uh the collaborative government of fishi uh who
25:25
used to be the hero of France you know pan Marshall pan but there was another
25:31
man called deul and the and the French Resistance which refused to give
25:37
up and eventually they won and uh if people in Algeria who
25:44
struggled against the French colonialism and who lost millions of
25:49
people in their struggle would think in a rational way they would not have
25:56
succeeded if people of South Africa have accepted aparti as a regimen they can
26:01
live with they would not have succeeded in liberating themselves so we are here
26:07
back to one of the clearest examples of a struggle of people against a colonial
26:14
power which is trying to crush them with one difference that a that not like in
26:21
France or or or or Algeria or South Africa this colonial power not only
26:28
wants to take over our land it wants to displace us all out of our land that is
26:35
the main difference and that should make us even more determined to fight back
26:41
and to struggle let’s let’s move a bit I mean it’s part of the same conversation but let’s actually just for our sake of our
26:47
audience just go a bit into the West Bank there’s two things I want to touch on the first is just since the ceasefire
26:53
is announced um there’s obviously been an acceleration of Israeli attacks bombardment ments on refugee camps and
26:59
neighborhoods in the West Bank bear in mind as you know this has been happening already but it’s just accelerated quite
27:05
a bit can you give us a sense of just how devastating the ethnic cleansing uh attempts and destruction in in the West
27:12
Bank is at the moment yeah there are three things happening in the West Bank three processes uh one is moving the war from
27:20
Gaza to the West Bank because the level of bombardment and attacks uh Israel has started using even
27:29
air strikes against people civilian population who are under their occupation in different parts of the
27:34
West Bank uh and they are using their all uh their Mighty military power to invade
27:41
areas to cause destruction the second process is the
27:47
ethnic cleansing of the people of the refugee camps in the north especially Janine tarim Shams and far
27:55
partially where the Israeli Army have already displaced almost 50,000 people
28:02
and it continues its operation in Janine camp for the 22nd day destroying the
28:08
infrastructure destroying tens of houses and buildings in a ruthless Mana destroying
28:17
electricity networks water pipes sewage systems everything and uh that is affecting even
28:25
the cities of Janine and to Karim but but that’s that’s these are not the only
28:30
places where the Israeli Army is acting actually they have imposed on the West
28:36
Bank no less than 920 military checkpoints each of these military
28:42
checkpoints U becomes a way of uh
28:47
humiliating people oppressing people torturing people sometimes and most importantly prevent preventing the
28:54
freedom of movement in the West Bank which has which is now cut into more than 300 pieces and the gates they put
29:02
in front of a village for instance when they put a gate and they close it that’s it the village becomes a prison nobody
29:09
can get in or out even if you have a medical emergency or people who need to go to universities or
29:15
whatever it’s a horrible situation and it is affecting the whole of the West Bank and that is done by the Army but in
29:23
addition to the Army you have um you have uh armed settlers illegal settlers
29:30
who are constantly attacking Palestinian communities and also trying to evi people 28 Palestinian communities have
29:37
already been eved by these illegal settlers with the help and support of and protection of the Israeli Army so
29:45
it’s a tough situation also in the West Bank and it’s growing it’s not stopping
29:50
and there is no no more any area in the West Bank which is can be said to be
29:55
under Palestinian Authority it’s over Israel took over everything and they can invade any City
30:01
they want any time they want uh and and this is another area
30:07
where Palestinians are struggling to survive and to stead fast and to stay
30:12
but that is the reality but I have to tell you that one of the worst thing that happened since October 7th is the
30:19
way Israel is treating the Palestinian prisoners I’ve met with some of the prisoners that were released in the last
30:26
exchange and they tell told me horrible stories I mean beaten every day each time they
30:35
come into their C to count them they beat them
30:41
uh one prisoner confirmed the case of of sexual
30:49
violation and maybe you can call it they use sticks
30:55
to to rape people he told me about 25 cases he knew
31:04
about and another case they forced people to to to be naked completely and
31:10
then put the prisoners one on top of the other worse image than what happened in
31:17
Abu grab and then the soldiers would be taking photos and sending the photos to their girlfriends and laughing at the
31:26
people but the p the humiliation the
31:31
starvation nobody came out of jail that haven’t lost one3 or one or 40% of their
31:40
weight or even maybe more I I was very angry when President Trump was talking
31:46
about the three Israeli prisoners who looked uh who had lost weight their weight because they were starved by
31:53
Netanyahu these people were in the north and they and their guards were starving
31:58
but nevertheless these three cases became the topic of all Western media
32:03
and nobody said anything about the thousands of Palestinian prisoners who are kept in horrible
32:10
condition you know people ask me what hurts you more of everything that had
32:15
happened the the killing the deaths the injuries the people I know about that uh
32:22
were terribly uh terribly affected by losing everything they had but you know what
32:30
what what what was the most hurting thing is the fact that we are not
32:37
accepted as equal human beings by not only Trump by Western
32:42
media at large by Western governments this level of white supremacy and racism
32:50
towards the Palestinian people is nothing but Fascism and actually what we are dealing
32:57
with with with the Israelis now is nothing but fascism that fascism that you see also
33:03
in the behavior of many other governments that this is this is the most painful thing and I think if people
33:10
are objective they will remember that Gaza really exposed these flaws of the
33:16
world today um you mentioned uh in your in your in your answer earlier on you
33:22
mentioned that uh almost the whole of the West Bank is is in control Now by Israel not the Palestinian Authority
33:28
but just how much legitimacy has the Palestinian Authority lost uh can you
33:35
tell me more about that just tell me the sentiment tell me why tell me what they’ve they’ve what they’ve done what
33:41
they’ve been sort of collaborated with Israel with just more details than than than than the average person would know
33:48
I think the biggest problem the Palestinian Authority has is the fact that we did not have free Democratic
33:53
elections since 20 years and that the The Authority cancelled the
34:01
Palestinian legislative Council and dissolved it illegally in
34:07
2018 and that we don’t have any separation between the Judiciary executive and legislative
34:13
systems and that we are ruled by decrees Presidential decrease the number
34:20
of Presidential decrees is much larger than the number of laws that were passed by the any legislative Council in
34:27
Palestine but on top of that of course it’s the lack of unity and uh for instance now
34:35
people are very angry because we we managed to go to Moscow and then beIN
34:41
all the 14 Palestinian forces and we reached an agreement that I participated
34:47
in drafting personally beIN declaration which is in my opinion a very realistic uh
34:53
applicable way of solving the internal Palestinian problems and it talks about forming a national
35:00
consensus government but the Palestinian Authority is obstructing the implementation it refuses to
35:07
implementation so uh this lack of movement towards Unity is of course making people angry but there are other
35:15
things the lack of understanding that the two illusions that they had before
35:21
are gone and they still keep hoping for them the illusion of that the Zionist
35:27
movement and Israel could accept a a compromise with
35:33
Palestinians uh they don’t understand that this is over and Israel doesn’t want any
35:39
compromise and uh the second thing is that they still believe the United
35:45
States can be a mediator where you can see I mean what do you want more than Trump coming up
35:51
and saying I want to ethnically cleanse the Palestinians so these are flaws of course that affect them I mean I don’t
35:58
want to attack them or criticize them or anything the last thing I want is to be
36:04
busy with the uh conflict with any Palestinian but at the same time the
36:10
public is angry and it wants to see Unity it wants to see resilience it
36:16
wants to see a colle collective leadership unified leadership of the
36:22
Palestinians to face these most dramatic risks we ever had in our life it’s much
36:29
worse than even 1948 so yes of course it affects the
36:34
legitimacy and affects the popularity you’ve mentioned uh that the Palestinian Authority is unwilling to sort of play
36:40
ball with the the initiative you a broader group of Palestinians came up with in Beijing how much of that is
36:45
because of they of their own innate stubbornness or problems or and how much
36:51
of that is because of pressure from Israel um I mean I’m sure there’s there’s there’s a connection
36:58
I don’t have information about I mean like facts about the pressure but
37:04
probably it is there uh but I think it’s all about wrong calculation of reading
37:10
the situation and the future and maybe part of it is about uh
37:17
self-preservation and worry and fear from the dramatic changes that are
37:24
happening around us okay I just want to know sort of speak a bit broader um and
37:30
when I say speak a bit broader it’s that I mean we need to think and really try
37:36
to use our imaginations and think out of the box and thought of to understand how Liberation will come about um because it
37:43
I mean it’s been a very long journey and I think even in ‘ 67 when when you know the Naka happened and Israel formerly
37:50
occupied Gaza and the West Bank you probably were you were a young person back then we spoke about this the last
37:56
time and you probably then would have thought that by 2025 the occupation would have ended and it hasn’t um so
38:01
this could take a a long time it could take 40 50 60 years maybe another Century it could be over next year right
38:09
um obviously the the sooner the better um but I mean you mention that that if
38:14
needs be Palestinians will will die on their land um let’s explore other options um to
38:22
what extent do you think that Palestinian Liberation is now connected
38:27
to Greater liberation of Arab peoples who have been living under oppressive regimes for a long time um in almost all
38:34
the neighboring countries of Palestine and even Beyond well it was always
38:40
connected it’s not new and uh I said several times on
38:47
different interviews that wise people should remember what happened after
38:54
1948 so many Arab regimes were changed and the
38:59
repercussion of what happened the defeat that happened in 1948 was
39:05
huge and uh I do believe that uh you can of course some governments can suppress
39:13
people can rule people can oppress people and prevent
39:18
them from expressing their views but they cannot rule their hearts and
39:25
minds and I know that the vast not vast majority I
39:31
think 99.9% of Arab people are with palistine and uh they they will not they will not
39:41
uh accept what they are trying to do to us so this will have repercussions of
39:47
course but I do agree with you I do agree with you if it wasn’t for this the
39:53
the the the the weaker the regime is in any country the and we’ve seen examples of that in
40:00
so many Arab countries that were destroyed by the Americans and by let’s call it imperialist forces in the
40:08
world uh when a regime is in bad relationship
40:13
with its own people it becomes absolutely vulnerable to external pressure and that is the explanation of
40:21
why some countries have very weak positions you look at countries like you
40:27
Cuba for instance I’m not talking about ideology here I’m talking about the the
40:33
nature of a country that has been in Revolution since 1959 the Americans are their neighbors
40:40
they tried to evade them to invade them they tried to kill them they tried to organize so many kitas and they failed
40:47
why if they hadn’t have relations good relations with their people they would not have
40:53
survived and uh that’s that’s why I think yes democracy is a very important
40:59
element here the Democratic the the the more a country is
41:04
in in harmony with its own people and the more it has a democratic
41:10
way of governance the stronger it would be and it won’t be vulnerable to external
41:16
pressures um I mean just while we’re on that point I I mean it may be beyond the Ambit and obviously I’m going to talk
41:23
about Syria now um and obviously the the the government in Syria is still very new so it’s a bit probably too early to
41:29
speculate on on exactly what they’ll stand and what they will do but um Bashar al-assad wasn’t necessarily kind
41:36
to Palestinians in any way he he killed many Palestinians in yuk he subjugated many Palestinians in Syria to the same
41:42
treatment that he subjugated his own people to um but the Assad regime did
41:47
verbally from time to time support Palestinian causes Through The Years um do you feel that now the Palestinian
41:54
people have a much stronger Ally uh in the Damascus um like I said even though
41:59
it’s very new government and there’s a lot of uncertainty how do you feel about that it all depends on how the regime
42:05
will deal with the fact that Israel is occupying its land that’s the most important
42:12
indicator and now I just heard that the Israeli Army has put checkpoints between
42:18
D and the road to Damascus I think and and
42:23
ketra I mean how will they deal with this the I mean just recently they’ve made a statement about Israeli
42:30
occupation of their land but but but this is the indicator if they are going to defend
42:37
their land and if they want to get rid of the Israeli occupation as we do we
42:42
will simply be allies of course but I think the there is there is a great need
42:49
for them to take that position against the Israeli aggression on Syrian land
42:54
isn’t it a bit more I mean I hear what you’re saying but it doesn’t also require some Nuance I mean because at
43:00
the same time it’s a fragile state it’s a fragile government um they could very easily again be accused of being
43:06
extremists and Al-Qaeda and and lose legitimacy um they also have a duty to kind of rebuild their country after a
43:12
very big devastating War where millions of people were made refugees so I’m not
43:18
saying that they should but I mean I’m I’m sure just like you know in the same way that King Abdullah was shuffling in
43:24
in his chair very uncomfortably there’s their own Shuffle that they have to kind of make um you know I mean where they
43:31
need to kind of play a game where they get legitimacy and can lift the sanctions on their country and make
43:37
international allies so they can rebuild a strong State and and immediately going
43:42
up against the Israeli checkpoints that are being set up may deter that I don’t agree with
43:50
that I don’t think that uh ends justify means and uh I think there are
43:57
principles positions that have to be taken when it comes to the sovereignity
44:02
of your country and uh I’m not saying the I know
44:08
that Israel destroyed their army completely and destroyed their military forces totally I’m not asking them to go
44:14
into war with Israel but there has to be clear stance against what Israel has
44:20
done to them Israel used the momentum to destroy all defense capabilities of
44:25
Syria and now Israel is engaging in two processes one is occupying the land of
44:32
Syria in a much wider amount of land and now they are in the process of expanding the annexation they’ve already annexed
44:39
the Golan Heights there should be at least a position saying that we don’t accept the annexation of our land you
44:45
know and second Israel is playing another game of divide and conquer
44:51
playing on the issue of Drews and the issue of Kurds etc etc so
44:57
Israel in this case is an enemy not only because they are occupying their
45:02
land but they are an enemy of their future because they are trying to keep Syria divided and weak Dr must uh final
45:11
question um youve obviously this last year you you’ve probably know many people who have been killed a lot of
45:17
Palestinian leaders have been killed you a prominent Palestinian leader yourself have you feared for your own life um
45:23
what measures have you taken to kind of ensure that you are kept alive um what’s
45:28
your thoughts on that well I I know I my life is at risk uh that’s not uh
45:38
surprising what can I do I mean if uh I will not have a military crowd around me
45:45
to protect me I don’t think this is the way uh I don’t feel that I am different from
45:53
anybody else or that I am better than anybody else I was almost killed three
45:58
times already in uh 96 I was shot twice with live ammunitions by an Israeli
46:05
sniper who saw me that while I was trying to treat an injured person and
46:11
stop the bleading and I was in my white coat I wasn’t doing political work I was
46:17
doing medical work and that sniper shot me I I still carry 34 shrap naels in my
46:23
back and shoulders I was lucky it was just a of maybe 1
46:29
cm and um then you know you you know I was
46:34
attacked several times I was stabbed once in
46:40
2015 what will happen will happen but the most important thing is that there is a duty that I have to fulfill as a
46:48
person as a me as a a Palestinian and if I I have capabilities
46:53
that can serve my people our people uh then I have to use them and
47:01
uh it’s God’s will at the end of the day what will happen will happen any any
47:07
final thoughts before we conclude my last thought is that I
47:14
believe that we will succeed I I have I am full of uh internal calm that this
47:23
case is the case of Justice of the Palestinian people as you said I don’t know this uh we will
47:30
be free in 2 years 10 years 15 years 50 years maybe not in my lifetime I don’t
47:38
know but I know one thing we will be free I know one thing Justice will
47:43
come I know one thing that the Palestinian people will overcome and it will be a great
47:51
honor for anybody to be participant in this liberation
47:58
Dr Musta buti thank you so much we know that you have a little time so thank you for for sharing it with us and uh best
48:03
of luck with everything thank you
oooooo
Political activist calls for key government figures to ‘go to jail’ over complicity in Gaza crimes
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXOldK2vNzk)Speaking to MEE at today’s pro-Palestine protest in London, journalist and political activist Owen Jones declared that he “firmly believes” Keir Starmer and David Lammy should one day face jail time for their role in ‘facilitating some of the worst crimes imaginable’ in Gaza. The demonstration, which was attended by an estimated 150,000 people, protested against Trump’s Gaza displacement plans, with crowds showing up despite strict restrictions on the January 18th protest, which some have said contravened the right to protest.
Transkripzioa:
0:00
the reason we’re out protesting today is
0:02
we’ve had over 16 months of genocide on
0:04
Mayhem guyss are wiped from the face of
0:05
the Earth potentially hundreds of
0:07
thousands of people slaughtered mostly
0:09
women mostly children and some of the
0:11
most obscene crimes of our age
0:14
facilitated by Western Government like
0:16
the British government which continues
0:17
for example to supply crucial components
0:20
for F35 Jets to tr death and destruction
0:22
of G there but also we’re here because
0:24
of Trump’s genocidal proposition and it
0:26
is a genocidal proposition we use
0:28
cleansing often as a eism which came
0:31
about in the
0:33
1990s but you know the violent removal
0:37
of whoever survives the violent horrors
0:41
of the genocidal onsport is a genocidal
0:43
proposition and and Donald Trump has
0:45
confessed the genocide he said a whole
0:47
civilization is being destroyed that in
0:50
itself is genocidal so you know we’re
0:53
here with protested but I think also him
0:55
as Witnesses we’ve got to be clear that
0:58
no CL has been so contested by its
1:00
perpetrators as it happened and not’s
1:02
been so documented by its victims as it
1:04
happened and no one can be able to say
1:07
they didn’t know it’s just loudly
1:08
broadcast in public what’s actually
1:10
happening and when accountability comes
1:12
as I believe it will uh those who are
1:15
complicit in this will have to account
1:18
for what they did and they won’t be able
1:19
to say I didn’t really know what was
1:21
happening and as you know there were
1:23
there were Mass arrests at a previous
1:25
protest where where people tried to
1:26
raise awareness as you said um and yet
1:29
people have come back out today what do
1:31
you think that says about the UK protest
1:33
movement well last time there’s a
1:35
violent Crackdown attempts basically on
1:38
those who are exercising their right to
1:39
peaceful protest and I think the reason
1:42
people have refused to be intimidated by
1:45
that is firstly they know this crime is
1:48
too big they they know that feeling
1:51
scared in the face of that is ridiculous
1:53
because if that makes people feel scared
1:56
and would it’s like to be a Palestinian
1:58
every day suffering the horrible
2:01
violent genocidal consequences of an
2:04
onslaught which our government help
2:05
facilitate I mean that’s real fear you
2:07
know I mean what we have to lose is
2:09
infinitely less than anything that
2:11
Palestinians have to lose um but also I
2:15
think it’s about refusing to allow the
2:16
world to be turned on his head because
2:18
that’s what they tried to do since began
2:19
to try and portray those who oppose the
2:22
mass SWS of innocent people including so
2:24
many children who oppos the destruction
2:26
of hospitals the murder of Medics who
2:28
oppose deliberate starvation who oppos
2:30
wiping out all civilian infrastructure
2:32
homes schools hospitals universities
2:35
liaries mosques churches we could go on
2:37
oppose those crimes uh torture rape uh
2:40
to to betray us as though we’re the
2:42
violent dangerous hateful extremists and
2:44
the people who support those crimes of
2:46
respectable mainstream moderate people
2:48
that’s ridiculous and yes those who
2:50
stood against this crime have been
2:52
harassed and silenced and deep
2:53
platformed and arrested but we can’t
2:57
allow them to win by trying to to to
3:00
portray this as a case of the people who
3:02
oppose mass murder are the real
3:05
dangerous problem and the people who
3:07
support are are somehow victims it’s
3:10
ridiculous so we’ll keep marching we’ll
3:12
keep protesting we’re never going to be
3:13
harassed H into silence and if the
3:16
Palestinian people they can show the
3:18
resilience they’ve shown the least we
3:20
can do is to show a bit of resilience as
3:22
well in the in the face of all these
3:24
pressures what’s your message to the UK
3:26
government what do you want to see
3:27
Storer
3:28
do the the British government is stop
3:31
being complicit in genocide um you have
3:33
helped facilitate some of the worst
3:35
possible war crimes um only um
3:38
suspending 8% of arm sales it does not
3:42
absolve you of your criminal
3:43
responsibility you know what Israel has
3:46
done um your intelligence Services know
3:49
what Israel has done and I firmly
3:52
believe that K and David Ramy in
3:54
particular needs one day to go to jail
3:57
they need to go to jail because they
3:59
help facilitate one of the worst
4:01
possible imaginable crimes they knew
4:03
what was happening they don’t have any
4:04
excuses and unless we hold to account
4:09
those people who facilitated this we are
4:11
going to normalize this depravity and
4:14
there lies the road to health all
4:17
Humanity not just people I don’t think
4:19
that’s a utopian farfetched idea it
4:21
might take years it might take decades
4:24
but you’re going to go to jail and
4:25
you’re going to go to jail because this
4:27
crime is too obscene for you to get away
4:30
what you’ve done
oooooo
@tobararbulu # mmt@tobararbulu
ooo
Francesca Albanese: The Palestinians have been facing erasure for 100 years
At an event at Pakhuis de Zwijger in Amsterdam, moderated by TNI’s Shaun Matsheza, Francesca Albanese, Omar Barghouti, and Angélique Eijpe analysed Israel’s genocide against Palestinians in occupied Gaza as the most profound crisis of international law and order of recent times. They explored what can be done practically, legally and politically, to address this crisis. Focusing on the legal and ethical obligations of states, companies, institutions and individuals, the speakers outlined some of the next steps needed to achieve accountability and meaningfully contribute to Palestinian liberation.
Transkripzioa:
0:00
if you ask many Palestinians under
0:01
Israeli occupation right now and brutal
0:04
assault they wouldn’t know what this
0:06
fire looks like because the fire is not
0:08
seized for them I think that this period
0:11
has exposed the extent and in fact and
0:14
the lent and the magnitude and the
0:16
dimension of the Palestinian exceptions
0:19
because international law has been
0:22
experienced by Palestinians in its AB
0:25
absence and its lack of Effectiveness
0:28
rather than its capacity
0:30
of Empower and bring Justice it’s
0:33
political power economic power Financial
0:35
power and what is exposed today is the
0:38
extent of the influence of the two
0:41
latter over the former we live in a
0:44
system where clearly geopolitical
0:47
interests and financial interests are as
0:50
powerful as to not only to make certain
0:53
people in power or not and when I say in
0:56
power I also think of the media and the
0:58
power they hold
1:00
able not to see to turn their eyes away
1:04
while civilians are being slaughtered
1:06
literally we have not spare spared
1:08
ourselves anything in terms of brutality
1:11
and still this last assault on Gaza has
1:14
been brutal particularly for how it has
1:17
scarred the children I’m aware there are
1:19
children in this room and I will not get
1:21
into the usual Spiel of the horrors but
1:24
again no one should see children hanging
1:28
from the wall and this is what what I’ve
1:30
seen and this is not something that
1:32
certain people have prepared not to see
1:34
this is something that has been
1:36
Justified and enabled including in this
1:38
country including in my own country so
1:41
we need to reflect together on how did
1:44
we get there and also what has been
1:47
exposed the extent the extent of how
1:51
rationalized is the system we live in
1:54
again it’s not that we didn’t know but
1:56
now it’s see in daylight it’s
1:59
Unapologetic
2:00
and it it’s so rapacious and Furious
2:04
that it doesn’t disdain hitting on us if
2:08
we protest in our liberal democracy or
2:11
as Omar baruti would say in our Kai
2:14
liberal
2:16
democracies we are seeing Erasure of the
2:18
Palestinian people we are seeing what
2:21
risk to be the ultimate stage of the
2:23
rasal of the Palestinian people because
2:25
the Palestinian people are under threat
2:29
and in fact have been facing eraser for
2:31
100 years 100 years it’s 100 years that
2:34
the Palestinians deal with the brutal
2:36
phase of European colonialism I’m sorry
2:39
but this is the reality I understand the
2:42
plight of the Holocaust has been a
2:44
tragedy but this is something this is
2:46
our responsibility and has been
2:48
Unleashed on the
2:49
Palestinians what does Justice Means
2:52
today for sure it means accountability
2:55
accountability today it must be
2:57
retributive Justice it must be Justice
3:00
that hits the Architects that those that
3:03
these genocides have ordered and also
3:08
executed as much as possible because
3:11
this I and and and in in a way this is
3:14
the culmination we wouldn’t have been
3:17
here speaking tonight hadn’t it been for
3:21
the impunity that Israel has enjoyed
3:23
since it’s very existence and before in
3:26
fact and this must end but Justice
3:28
cannot be understood on only as
3:31
retributive the
3:33
Palestinians deserve historical Justice
3:36
it’s part of the DNA of the Palestinian
3:38
people as nakba survivors where there
3:40
are other Holocaust that have not hit
3:43
the entirety of a people when a given
3:45
people was distributed around the world
3:48
the Palestinian people are all nakba
3:51
survivors because their Homeland has
3:54
been dismembered and they have have
3:56
become a nation scared around the world
4:00
it must be restorative as well it’s
4:03
important to focus on the perpetrators
4:05
but it’s even more important to focus on
4:07
the victims and I don’t like this term
4:09
much but at the same at the same time
4:12
while they are strong and resilient and
4:15
we should not romanticize there are also
4:17
people who have very deep wounds that
4:20
need to be healed the Palestinians are
4:22
an incredible really resilient people
4:24
with a strong sense of identity and
4:27
generosity this will help but they need
4:29
to to have the conditions to heal and
4:32
it’s not going to be easy since the
4:33
beginning of the fire 5,000 children
4:36
have been found with permanent cognitive
4:40
dysfunction they won’t heal this won’t
4:43
heal and
4:45
41% of the adult population in Gaza
4:48
meaning anyone above
4:51
18 is taking care of children who are
4:53
not his or her own so this is the
4:56
situation what has happened in
5:00
Gaza is a genocide and I have no doubt
5:03
about that now 870 Palestinians have
5:06
been killed in the West Bank since
5:08
October
5:10
203 870 including 170 kids and it
5:15
continues but also already in October I
5:18
was reporting when the Palestinians
5:19
killed in the West Bank were 700 and the
5:23
attack on the health facilities and
5:25
civilian infrastructure the health
5:27
facility in the West Bank has been
5:29
attacked more times than in Gaza but of
5:32
course in Gaza it has been more
5:34
destructive why we destroying hospitals
5:37
clinics and ambulances and targeting
5:40
medical personnel in the West Bank and
5:43
the other thing is the
5:45
torture nearly 10,000 Palestinians have
5:47
been arrested and detained in the web
5:49
Bank no new Israel has done it Israel
5:52
has I’ve analyzed this this was my
5:54
second report and this is why nothing of
5:56
what we are seeing is new is not
5:58
surprising is shocking but not
6:00
surprising and so they have been
6:02
arrested and detained arbitrarily by an
6:04
unlawful occupation and many of them
6:07
have been tortur and I don’t have
6:08
updated figures but until end of October
6:11
7 bisans were killed while in detention
6:14
many of them under torture it’s really
6:16
brutal so in the face of all this shall
6:19
we despair not really if we have time to
6:21
despair it means that we have also a lot
6:23
of privilege I’m not saying that because
6:25
what we feel is not real this is what we
6:27
are as human beings I mean and think of
6:30
the Palestinians Among Us think of the
6:32
Palestinians that on top of what were
6:35
they were suffering seeing what was done
6:36
to their people and I often say I’ve
6:38
learned from the Palestinians and other
6:40
people from the Arab region I mean a a a
6:44
people is like a body you chop a limb
6:47
and the entire body suffers and this is
6:49
what gives us the idea of what has been
6:50
happening to them and they and the
6:52
Palestinians have continued to be killed
6:54
and blamed and smeared I mean in this
6:57
part of the world you talk to people and
6:58
seem that the Palestinian brought this
7:00
avoc upon themselves last just like that
7:03
let’s forget 100 Years of dispossession
7:06
displacement let’s forget 57 years of
7:09
unlawful occupation that has turned into
7:11
a vehicle to steal the land to displace
7:14
the people in the name of security and
7:17
more and more now and this is shocking
7:19
in
7:20
2025
7:21
God so what we need to do is not to
7:25
despair I keep on saying hope is a
7:28
discipline it’s not my quote I’m
7:29
sighting someone else we have three
7:31
things to do educate ourselves and
7:34
others we need to know we need to know
7:37
the facts and we need to know what it
7:40
means legally because not because we
7:42
need to be mini mini lawyers no but
7:44
because this allows you empowers you to
7:46
see how your political representatives
7:49
are betraying your Constitution the
7:52
rules that you have in this country and
7:55
are making you responsible of the
7:57
situation in the occupied Palestinian
7:59
territory it’s important to educate
8:02
others we need to push back on the
8:04
narrative that has been imposed I mean
8:06
it’s incredible how much the public
8:09
debate has been dominated by Voices who
8:12
have really reproduced and Amplified I
8:15
wouldn’t say the Israeli narrative the
8:18
government’s narrative the military
8:20
narrative because there are also
8:21
Israelis who are fighting
8:23
against side by side one step behind
8:26
because ultimately this is the
8:28
liberation of the Palestinian people of
8:30
course Jewish Israelis have our
8:32
responsibility of course and they those
8:34
who fight honestly one one step behind
8:37
the Palestinians but they are against
8:39
the aparti occupation and genocide do
8:42
you hear them in our TVs or on our
8:46
newspapers no and the the other thing is
8:48
that we need to ReDiscover a sense of
8:51
togetherness a sense of community among
8:53
Community who thinks together and act
8:56
together and international law it
8:59
continue to be used by some invoked when
9:01
it’s convenient and then referred to as
9:03
a useless paraphernalia of some walk
9:06
culture and no instead an international
9:09
law is an system of rules and mechanisms
9:13
that should restrain confine politics
9:17
and even diplomacy and this is something
9:19
we need to know and resolving the
9:21
question of Palestinian international
9:23
law according to international law is
9:25
not complicated it’s simple it’s simple
9:27
I know it’s e easier said than done I
9:30
know but this is where we need to go the
9:32
goal is end the genocide now it’s not
9:35
over despite the ceire end the
9:37
occupation by there is a deadline you
9:40
know by by September this year Israel
9:42
has been ordered by the international
9:44
court of justice to withdraw the troops
9:46
to dismantle the settlements and to
9:48
relinquish any form of control that it
9:50
has on Palestinian resources because it
9:54
has practiced racial discrimination and
9:57
apartheid and annexation and reparation
10:00
and do not hamper the return of those
10:02
who have been displaced and these are
10:05
also responsibility that your government
10:07
here has to make it happen all the more
10:10
at the time of a genocide and it
10:12
shouldn’t have transferred or it should
10:14
not transfer arms directly or indirectly
10:17
in to the or in parts to to Israel so we
10:21
need to think together and act together
10:23
this is what we have to do
oooooo
@tobararbulu # mmt@tobararbulu
ooo
Israel unlikely to move to second phase of ceasefire deal with Hamas in power: Analysis
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siiQOUXcU_8)Former Israeli diplomat Alon Pinkas told Al Jazeera he doesn’t believe the ceasefire between Hamas and Israel will move into the second phase, due to start on March 1, which would include a permanent ceasefire and an almost full Israeli withdrawal from the Gaza Strip, with Hamas staying in power. While Hamas has been significantly degraded militarily, politically they maintain power and there’s no replacement to fill the vacuum, Pinkas said. Meanwhile, Xavier Abu Eid, a political analyst, speaks to Al Jazeera from Bethlehem in the occupied West Bank. He says, “The furore surrounding the provocative shirts emblazoned with slogans that Palestinian prisoners were made to wear by the Israeli prison authorities upon their release underscores a long policy of ‘humiliation’.”
Transkripzioa:
0:00
if you ask many Palestinians under
0:01
Israeli occupation right now and brutal
0:04
assault they wouldn’t know what this
0:06
fire looks like because the fire is not
0:08
seized for them I think that this period
0:11
has exposed the extent and in fact and
0:14
the lent and the magnitude and the
0:16
dimension of the Palestinian exceptions
0:19
because international law has been
0:22
experienced by Palestinians in its AB
0:25
absence and its lack of Effectiveness
0:28
rather than its capacity
0:30
of Empower and bring Justice it’s
0:33
political power economic power Financial
0:35
power and what is exposed today is the
0:38
extent of the influence of the two
0:41
latter over the former we live in a
0:44
system where clearly geopolitical
0:47
interests and financial interests are as
0:50
powerful as to not only to make certain
0:53
people in power or not and when I say in
0:56
power I also think of the media and the
0:58
power they hold
1:00
able not to see to turn their eyes away
1:04
while civilians are being slaughtered
1:06
literally we have not spare spared
1:08
ourselves anything in terms of brutality
1:11
and still this last assault on Gaza has
1:14
been brutal particularly for how it has
1:17
scarred the children I’m aware there are
1:19
children in this room and I will not get
1:21
into the usual Spiel of the horrors but
1:24
again no one should see children hanging
1:28
from the wall and this is what what I’ve
1:30
seen and this is not something that
1:32
certain people have prepared not to see
1:34
this is something that has been
1:36
Justified and enabled including in this
1:38
country including in my own country so
1:41
we need to reflect together on how did
1:44
we get there and also what has been
1:47
exposed the extent the extent of how
1:51
rationalized is the system we live in
1:54
again it’s not that we didn’t know but
1:56
now it’s see in daylight it’s
1:59
Unapologetic
2:00
and it it’s so rapacious and Furious
2:04
that it doesn’t disdain hitting on us if
2:08
we protest in our liberal democracy or
2:11
as Omar baruti would say in our Kai
2:14
liberal
2:16
democracies we are seeing Erasure of the
2:18
Palestinian people we are seeing what
2:21
risk to be the ultimate stage of the
2:23
rasal of the Palestinian people because
2:25
the Palestinian people are under threat
2:29
and in fact have been facing eraser for
2:31
100 years 100 years it’s 100 years that
2:34
the Palestinians deal with the brutal
2:36
phase of European colonialism I’m sorry
2:39
but this is the reality I understand the
2:42
plight of the Holocaust has been a
2:44
tragedy but this is something this is
2:46
our responsibility and has been
2:48
Unleashed on the
2:49
Palestinians what does Justice Means
2:52
today for sure it means accountability
2:55
accountability today it must be
2:57
retributive Justice it must be Justice
3:00
that hits the Architects that those that
3:03
these genocides have ordered and also
3:08
executed as much as possible because
3:11
this I and and and in in a way this is
3:14
the culmination we wouldn’t have been
3:17
here speaking tonight hadn’t it been for
3:21
the impunity that Israel has enjoyed
3:23
since it’s very existence and before in
3:26
fact and this must end but Justice
3:28
cannot be understood on only as
3:31
retributive the
3:33
Palestinians deserve historical Justice
3:36
it’s part of the DNA of the Palestinian
3:38
people as nakba survivors where there
3:40
are other Holocaust that have not hit
3:43
the entirety of a people when a given
3:45
people was distributed around the world
3:48
the Palestinian people are all nakba
3:51
survivors because their Homeland has
3:54
been dismembered and they have have
3:56
become a nation scared around the world
4:00
it must be restorative as well it’s
4:03
important to focus on the perpetrators
4:05
but it’s even more important to focus on
4:07
the victims and I don’t like this term
4:09
much but at the same at the same time
4:12
while they are strong and resilient and
4:15
we should not romanticize there are also
4:17
people who have very deep wounds that
4:20
need to be healed the Palestinians are
4:22
an incredible really resilient people
4:24
with a strong sense of identity and
4:27
generosity this will help but they need
4:29
to to have the conditions to heal and
4:32
it’s not going to be easy since the
4:33
beginning of the fire 5,000 children
4:36
have been found with permanent cognitive
4:40
dysfunction they won’t heal this won’t
4:43
heal and
4:45
41% of the adult population in Gaza
4:48
meaning anyone above
4:51
18 is taking care of children who are
4:53
not his or her own so this is the
4:56
situation what has happened in
5:00
Gaza is a genocide and I have no doubt
5:03
about that now 870 Palestinians have
5:06
been killed in the West Bank since
5:08
October
5:10
203 870 including 170 kids and it
5:15
continues but also already in October I
5:18
was reporting when the Palestinians
5:19
killed in the West Bank were 700 and the
5:23
attack on the health facilities and
5:25
civilian infrastructure the health
5:27
facility in the West Bank has been
5:29
attacked more times than in Gaza but of
5:32
course in Gaza it has been more
5:34
destructive why we destroying hospitals
5:37
clinics and ambulances and targeting
5:40
medical personnel in the West Bank and
5:43
the other thing is the
5:45
torture nearly 10,000 Palestinians have
5:47
been arrested and detained in the web
5:49
Bank no new Israel has done it Israel
5:52
has I’ve analyzed this this was my
5:54
second report and this is why nothing of
5:56
what we are seeing is new is not
5:58
surprising is shocking but not
6:00
surprising and so they have been
6:02
arrested and detained arbitrarily by an
6:04
unlawful occupation and many of them
6:07
have been tortur and I don’t have
6:08
updated figures but until end of October
6:11
7 bisans were killed while in detention
6:14
many of them under torture it’s really
6:16
brutal so in the face of all this shall
6:19
we despair not really if we have time to
6:21
despair it means that we have also a lot
6:23
of privilege I’m not saying that because
6:25
what we feel is not real this is what we
6:27
are as human beings I mean and think of
6:30
the Palestinians Among Us think of the
6:32
Palestinians that on top of what were
6:35
they were suffering seeing what was done
6:36
to their people and I often say I’ve
6:38
learned from the Palestinians and other
6:40
people from the Arab region I mean a a a
6:44
people is like a body you chop a limb
6:47
and the entire body suffers and this is
6:49
what gives us the idea of what has been
6:50
happening to them and they and the
6:52
Palestinians have continued to be killed
6:54
and blamed and smeared I mean in this
6:57
part of the world you talk to people and
6:58
seem that the Palestinian brought this
7:00
avoc upon themselves last just like that
7:03
let’s forget 100 Years of dispossession
7:06
displacement let’s forget 57 years of
7:09
unlawful occupation that has turned into
7:11
a vehicle to steal the land to displace
7:14
the people in the name of security and
7:17
more and more now and this is shocking
7:19
in
7:20
2025
7:21
God so what we need to do is not to
7:25
despair I keep on saying hope is a
7:28
discipline it’s not my quote I’m
7:29
sighting someone else we have three
7:31
things to do educate ourselves and
7:34
others we need to know we need to know
7:37
the facts and we need to know what it
7:40
means legally because not because we
7:42
need to be mini mini lawyers no but
7:44
because this allows you empowers you to
7:46
see how your political representatives
7:49
are betraying your Constitution the
7:52
rules that you have in this country and
7:55
are making you responsible of the
7:57
situation in the occupied Palestinian
7:59
territory it’s important to educate
8:02
others we need to push back on the
8:04
narrative that has been imposed I mean
8:06
it’s incredible how much the public
8:09
debate has been dominated by Voices who
8:12
have really reproduced and Amplified I
8:15
wouldn’t say the Israeli narrative the
8:18
government’s narrative the military
8:20
narrative because there are also
8:21
Israelis who are fighting
8:23
against side by side one step behind
8:26
because ultimately this is the
8:28
liberation of the Palestinian people of
8:30
course Jewish Israelis have our
8:32
responsibility of course and they those
8:34
who fight honestly one one step behind
8:37
the Palestinians but they are against
8:39
the aparti occupation and genocide do
8:42
you hear them in our TVs or on our
8:46
newspapers no and the the other thing is
8:48
that we need to ReDiscover a sense of
8:51
togetherness a sense of community among
8:53
Community who thinks together and act
8:56
together and international law it
8:59
continue to be used by some invoked when
9:01
it’s convenient and then referred to as
9:03
a useless paraphernalia of some walk
9:06
culture and no instead an international
9:09
law is an system of rules and mechanisms
9:13
that should restrain confine politics
9:17
and even diplomacy and this is something
9:19
we need to know and resolving the
9:21
question of Palestinian international
9:23
law according to international law is
9:25
not complicated it’s simple it’s simple
9:27
I know it’s e easier said than done I
9:30
know but this is where we need to go the
9:32
goal is end the genocide now it’s not
9:35
over despite the ceire end the
9:37
occupation by there is a deadline you
9:40
know by by September this year Israel
9:42
has been ordered by the international
9:44
court of justice to withdraw the troops
9:46
to dismantle the settlements and to
9:48
relinquish any form of control that it
9:50
has on Palestinian resources because it
9:54
has practiced racial discrimination and
9:57
apartheid and annexation and reparation
10:00
and do not hamper the return of those
10:02
who have been displaced and these are
10:05
also responsibility that your government
10:07
here has to make it happen all the more
10:10
at the time of a genocide and it
10:12
shouldn’t have transferred or it should
10:14
not transfer arms directly or indirectly
10:17
in to the or in parts to to Israel so we
10:21
need to think together and act together
10:23
this is what we have to do
oooooo
We Basques do need a real Basque independent State in the Western Pyrenees, just a democratic lay or secular state, with all the formal characteristics of any independent State: Central Bank, Treasury, proper currency, out of the European Distopia and faraway from NAT0, maybe being a BRICS partner…
IkusEuskal Herriaren independentzia eta Mikel Torka
oooooo
