From the River to the Sea: Ibaitik Itsasora (124) eta Jeffrey Sachs

Jeffrey Sachs’ Speech Goes Viral Amid Trump’s Tariff Tantrums| US| Europe| Russia| Ukraine

(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLa23PRD3wg)

U.S. economist Jeffrey Sachs’ fiery February 2025 speech at the European Parliament is going viral amid President Trump’s escalating tariff war. Sachs called on Europe to stop relying on the United States and develop its own independent foreign policy, warning that American influence and Trump’s sweeping reciprocal tariffs threaten global economic stability. As new trade barriers and U.S. policy moves rattle financial markets, his warning “Don’t trust America” resonates across Europe.

Transkripzioa:

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This is indeed a a complicated and fastchanging time and a and and a very

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dangerous one. So we really need clarity of thought. Um I’m especially interested

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in our conversation. So I’ll try to be as succinct and and clear as I can be.

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Uh I’ve watched the events very close up uh in Eastern Europe, the former Soviet

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Union, Russia uh very closely for the last uh 36 years. I was an adviser to

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the Polish government in 1989. Uh to uh President Gorbachev in 1990 and

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91 to President Yelen in 1991 to 1993

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to President Kuchma of Ukraine in 1993 94. I helped introduce the Estonian

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currency. I I helped uh several countries in uh former Yugoslavia,

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especially Slovenia. Uh I’ve watched the events very close up for 36 years.

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After the Maidan, I was uh asked by the new government to come to Kiev and I was

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taken around the Maidan and I learned a lot of things uh firsthand. I I’ve been

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in touch with Russian leaders for more than 30 years.

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I know the American political leadership uh close up uh our previous uh secretary

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of treasury was my macroeconomics teacher uh 51 years ago. Uh just to give

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you an idea. So we were very close friends for a half century. I know all

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of these people. I just want to say this because what I want to explain in my

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point of view is not uh secondhand. It’s not ideology. It’s what I’ve seen with

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my own eyes and experienced during this period

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in my understanding of the events that have befallen Europe in many contexts.

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uh and I’ll include not only the uh Ukraine crisis uh but uh Serbia 1999

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uh the wars in the Middle East including Iraq, Syria, uh the wars in Africa including

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Sudan, Somalia, uh Libya.

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These are to a very significant extent that would surprise you perhaps

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uh and would be denounced about what I’m about to say. These are

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wars that the United States led and caused.

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And this has been true for more than 40 years now.

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what happened uh more than 30 years I should say to be more precise

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the United States came to the view especially in 1990 911 and then with the

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end of the Soviet Union that the US now ran the world

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and that the US did not have to heed anybody’s views

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red lines, concerns, security viewpoints, or any international obligations or any

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UN framework. I’m sorry to put it so plainly, but I do want you to

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understand. I tried very hard in 1991

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to get help for Gorbachev, who I think was the greatest statesman of our modern

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time. I recently read the uh archived memo of

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the National Security Council discussion of my proposal, how they completely

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dismissed it and laughed it off the table when I said that the United States

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should help the Soviet Union in financial stabilization and in making its reforms. and the memo

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documents, including some of my former colleagues at Harvard in particular,

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saying we will do the minimum that we will do to prevent disaster, but

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the minimum, it’s not our job to help. Quite the contrary, it’s not our

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interest to help. When the Soviet Union ended in 1991,

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the view became even more exaggerated and I can name chapter and verse, but

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the view was we run the show. Cheney, Wolawitz, and many other names

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that you will have come to know literally believed this is now a US

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world and we will do as we want. We will

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clean up from the former Soviet Union. We will take out any remaining allies.

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countries like Iraq, Syria, and so forth will go.

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And we’ve been experiencing this foreign policy for now

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essentially 33 years. Europe has paid a heavy price for this

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because Europe has not had any foreign policy during this period that I can figure out.

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No voice, no unity, no clarity, no European interests, only American

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loyalty. There were moments where there were disagreements and very uh I think uh

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wonderful disagreements especially in the last time of significance was 2003

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in the Iraq war when France and Germany said we don’t support the United States

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going around the UN security council for this war. That war, by the way, was

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directly concocted by Netanyahu and his colleagues in the US uh

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Pentagon. I’m not saying that it was a link or mutuality. I’m saying it was a direct

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war. That was a war carried out for Israel. It was a war that Paul Wolitz and

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Douglas Feith coordinated with Netanyahu and that was the last time that Europe

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had a voice. And I spoke with European leaders then

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and they were very clear and it was uh quite wonderful.

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Europe lost its voice entirely after that but especially in 2008.

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Now what happened after 1991 to get to 2008 is that the United States decided

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that unipolarity meant that NATO would enlarge

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somewhere from Brussels to Vladivosto step by step. there would be no end to

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eastward enlargement of NATO. This would be the US unipolar world. If

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you played the game of risk as a child like I did, this is the US idea to have

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the peace on every part of the board. Any place without a US military base is

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an enemy. Basically, neutrality is a dirty word in the US

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political lexicon. Perhaps the dirtiest word. At least if you’re an enemy, we know you’re an

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enemy. Uh if you are neutral, you’re subversive

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because then you’re really against us because you’re not telling us. You’re pretending to be neutral.

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So this was the mindset and the decision was taken formally in 1994

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when President Clinton signed off on NATO enlargement to the east. You will

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recall that in February 7th, 1991,

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Hans Dietra Genture and James Baker III spoke with Gorbachev.

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Genture gave a press conference afterwards where he explained, “NATO

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will not move eastward. We will not take advantage of the

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dissolution of the Warsaw pact.” And understand that was in a jeritical

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context, not a casual context. This was the end of World War II being negotiated for

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German reunification and an agreement was made that NATO will

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not move one inch eastward. And it was explicit and it is in

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countless documents and just look up national security archive of George

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Washington University and you can get dozens of documents. It’s a website called what Gorbachov heard about NATO.

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Take a look because everything you’re told by the US is a lie about this. But

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the archives are perfectly clear. So the decision was taken in 1994

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to expand NATO all the way to Ukraine.

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This is a project. This is not one administration or another. This is a US

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government project that started more than 30 years ago.

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In 1997, Ziggnu Bjinski wrote the grand

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chessboard. That is not just musings of Mr. Bjinski. That is the presentation of the

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decisions of the United States government explained to the public.

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which is how these books work. And the book describes the eastward

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enlargement of Europe and of NATO as simultaneous events.

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And there’s a good chapter in that book that says, “What will Russia do as

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Europe and NATO expand eastward?” And I knew Zig Bjinski personally. He

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was very nice to me. Uh I was advising Poland. He was a big help. He was a very

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nice and smart man and he got everything wrong.

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So in 1997 he wrote in detail why Russia

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could do nothing but exceed to the eastward expansion of NATO and Europe.

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In fact, he says the eastward expansion of Europe and not just Europe but NATO.

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This was a plan, a project. And he explains how Russia will never

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align with China. Unthinkable. Russia will never align with Iran.

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Russia has no vocation other than the European vocation. So as Europe moves

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east, there’s nothing Russia can do about it. So says yet another American strategist.

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Is it any question why we’re in war all the time?

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Because one thing about America is we always know what our counterparts are going to do and we always get it wrong.

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And one reason we always get it wrong is that in game theory that the American

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strategists play, you don’t actually talk to the other side. You just know

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what the other side’s strategy is. That’s it’s wonderful. It saves so much time.

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You don’t need any diplomacy.

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So this project began and we had a continuity of government for 30 years

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until maybe yesterday perhaps.

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30 years of a project. Ukraine and Georgia were the keys to the project.

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Why? Because America learned everything it knows from the British.

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And so we are the wannabe British Empire.

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And what the British Empire understood in 1853,

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Mr. Palmer, Lord Palmerston, excuse me, is that you surround Russia in the Black

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Sea and you deny Russia access to the Eastern Mediterranean.

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And all you’re watching is an American project to do that in the 21st century.

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The idea was that there would be Ukraine,

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Romania, Bulgaria, Turkey, and Georgia as the Black Sea literal

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that would deprive Russia of any international

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status by blocking the Black Sea and

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essentially by neutralizing Russia as more than a local power. Bjinski is

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completely clear about this and before Bjinsky there was Mckinder

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and who owns the island of the world owns the world. So this project goes

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back a long time. I think it goes back basically to Palmerston

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in 19 and again I’ve lived through every administration. I’ve known these

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presidents. I’ve known their teams. Nothing changed much from Clinton to

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Bush to Obama to Trump won to Biden.

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Maybe they got worse step by step. Biden was the worst in my view. Uh maybe

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also because he was not compass for the last couple of years. And I say that

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seriously, not as a snarky remark. The American political system is a system of

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image. It’s a system of media manipulation every day. It is a PR

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system. And so you could have a president that basically doesn’t function and have that in power for two

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years and actually have that president run for reelection. And one damn thing

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is he had to stand on a stage for 90 minutes by himself and that was the end of it. Had it not been that mistake, he

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would have gone on to have his candidacy whether he was sleeping after 400 p.m.

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in the afternoon or not. So this is actually the reality.

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Everybody goes along with it. It’s impolite to say anything that I’m saying

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because we don’t speak the truth about almost anything in this world right now.

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So this project went on from the 1990s. Bombing Bgrade 78 straight days in 1999

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was part of this project. Splitting apart the country when borders

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are sacrosanked, aren’t they? Indeed, except for Kosovo.

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That’s fine because borders are sacrosanked except when America changes them.

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Sudan was another related project. The South Sudan rebellion. Did that just

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happen because South Sudin rebelled? or can I give you the CIA playbook

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to please understand as grown-ups what this is about.

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Military events are costly. They require equipment, training, base camps,

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intelligence, finance. That comes from big powers.

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That doesn’t come from local insurrections.

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South Sudan did not defeat North Sudan or Sudan

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in a tribal battle. It was a US project.

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I would go often to Nairobi and meet US military or senators or others with deep

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interests in Sudan’s politics. This was part of the game of

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unipolarity. So the NATO enlargement as you know started in 1999 with Hungary, Poland and

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the Czech Republic and Russia was extremely unhappy about it. But these were countries still far

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from the border and Russia protested but of course to no avail. Then George

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Bush Jr. came in when 9/11 occurred. President Putin pledged all support

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and then the US uh decided in September

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20th, 2001

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that it would launch seven wars in five years. And you can listen to General

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Wesley Clark online talk about that. He was NATO Supreme Commander in 1999.

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He went to the Pentagon on September 20th, 2001. He was handed the paper

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explaining seven wars. These, by the way, were Netanyahu’s wars.

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The idea was partly to clean up old Soviet allies and partly to take out

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supporters of Hamas and Hezbollah because Netanyahu’s idea was there will

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be one state. Thank you. Only one state. It will be Israel. Israel will control

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all of the territory and anyone that objects we will overthrow. Not we

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exactly our friend the United States. That’s US policy until this morning.

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We don’t know whether it will change. Now, the only wrinkle is that maybe the

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US will own Gaza instead of Israel owning Gaza.

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But the idea has been around at least for 25 years.

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It actually goes back to a document called Clean Break that Netanyahu and

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his American political team put together in 1996 to end the idea of the two-state

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solution. You can also find it online. So, these are projects. These are

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long-term events. These aren’t is it Clinton, is it Bush, is it Obama.

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That’s the boring way to look at American politics as the dayto-day game, but that’s not

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what American politics is. So, the next round of NATO enlargement

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came in 2004 with seven more countries,

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the three Baltic states, Romania, Bulgaria, Slovenia, and Slovakia.

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At this point, Russia was pretty damn upset. This was a complete violation of the

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postwar order agreed with German reunification.

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Essentially, it was a it it was a fundamental trick or

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defection of the US from a cooperative arrangement is what it amounted to because they

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believe in unipolarity. So, as everybody recalls, because we

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just had the Munich Security Conference last week in 2007, President Putin said, “Stop. Enough.

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Enough. Stop now.” And of course, what that meant was in

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2008, the United States jammed down Europe’s throat enlargement of NATO to

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Ukraine and to Georgia. This is a long-term project. I listened to Mr. Sakashi in New York in

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May of 2008. And I walked out, called Sonia, and said, “This man’s crazy.” And

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a month later, a war broke out. Because the United States told this guy, “We

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save Georgia.” And he stands at the Council on Foreign Relations says Georgia’s in the center of Europe. Well,

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it ain’t, ladies and gentlemen. It’s not in the center of Europe.

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And the most recent events are not helpful for Georgia for its safety and your MPs going there or MEPs going there

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and European politicians. That gets Georgia destroyed. That doesn’t save Georgia. That gets Georgia destroyed.

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Completely destroyed. In 2008, as everybody knows, our former CIA

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director, William Burns, sent a long message back to Condisa Rice. Net means

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net about expansion. This we know from Julian Assange because believe me, not

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one word is told to the American people about anything or to you or by any of

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your newspapers these days. So we have Julian Assange to thank but

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we can read the memo in detail. As you know Victor Yanukovich was

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elected in 2010 on the platform of neutrality. Russia had no territorial

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interests or designs in Ukraine at all. I know I was there during these pe these

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years. What Russia was negotiating was a 25-year lease to 20 42

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for Savasto naval base. That’s it. Not for Crimea, not for the Donbas.

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Nothing like that. This idea that Putin is reconstructing

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the Russian Empire. This is childish propaganda. Excuse me. If anyone knows

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the daytoday and year-to-year history, this is childish stuff.

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Childish stuff seems to work better than adult stuff. So, no designs at all. The United States

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decided this man must be overthrown. It’s called a regime change operation.

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There have been about a hundred of them by the United States. Many in your countries

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and many all over the world. That’s what the CIA does for a living.

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Okay? Please know it. It’s a very unusual kind of foreign policy.

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But in America, if you don’t like the other side, you don’t negotiate with

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them, you try to overthrow them,

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preferably covertly. If it doesn’t work covertly, you do it overtly.

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You always say, “It’s not our fault. They’re the aggressor. They’re the other side. They’re Hitler.” That comes up

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every two or three years. Whether it’s Saddam Hussein, whether it’s Assad, whether it’s Putin, that’s very

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convenient. That’s the only foreign policy explanation the American people are ever

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given anywhere. Well, we’re facing Munich 1938. Well,

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we’re facing Munich 1938. Can’t talk to the other side. They’re evil, implacable

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foes. That’s the only model of foreign policy we ever hear from our mass media and the

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mass media repeats it entirely because it’s completely suborned by the US

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government. Now in 2014

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the US worked actively to overthrow Yanukovich.

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Everybody knows the phone call intercepted by my Columbia University colleague Victoria Nuland

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and the US Ambassador Peter Pat. You don’t get better evidence. The

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Russians intercepted her call and they put it on the internet. Listen to it. It’s fascinating. I know all these

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people, by the way, by doing that they all got promoted in the Biden administration.

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That’s the job. Now, when the Maidan occurred, I was called immediately. Oh,

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Professor Saxs, the new Ukrainian prime minister would like to see you to talk

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about the economic crisis because I’m pretty good at that.

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And so I flew to Kiev and I was walked around the Maidan

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and I was told how the US paid the money for all the people around the Maidan.

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Spontaneous revolution of dignity.

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Ladies and gentlemen, please. Where do all these media outlets come

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from? Where does all this organization come from? Where do all these buses come

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from? Where do all these people called in come from? Are you kidding? This is

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organized effort and

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it’s not a secret except to citizens of Europe and the

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United States. Everyone else understands it quite clearly.

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Then came Minsk and especially Minsk 2 which by the way

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was modeled on South Turoleian autonomy and the Belgians could have related to

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Mitzu very well. It said there should be autonomy for the Russianspeaking

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regions in the east of Ukraine. It was supported unanimously by the UN

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Security Council. The United States and Ukraine decided it was not to be

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enforced. Germany and France, which were the guaranurs of the Normandy process,

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let it go. And it was absolutely another direct

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American unipolar action with Europe as usual playing completely

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useless subsidiary role even though it was a guarantor of the agreement.

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Trump one raised the armaments. There were many thousands of deaths in

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the shelling by Ukraine in the Donbas. There was no Minsk 2 agreement.

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And then Biden came into office. And again, I know all these people. I used

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to be a member of the Democratic Party. I now am strictly sworn to be a member

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of no party because both are the same anyway.

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And because this is I the Democrats became complete wararm mongers over time

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and there not was not one voice about peace just like most of your

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parliamentarians the same way. So at the end of 1991,

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Putin put on the table a last effort in two security agreement drafts. One with

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Europe and one with the United States. The US put on the table December 15th n

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uh 2021. I had an hour call with Jake Sullivan in

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the White House begging, “Jake, avoid the war.

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You can avoid the war. All you have to do is say NATO will not enlarge to

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Ukraine.” And he said to me, “Oh, NATO’s not going to enlarge to Ukraine. Don’t worry about

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it.” I said, “Jake, say it publicly.” No, no, no. We can’t say it publicly.

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said, “Jake, you’re going to have a war over something that isn’t even going to

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happen.” He said, “Don’t worry, Jeff. There will be no war.”

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These are not very bright people. I’m telling you, if I can give you my

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honest view, they’re not very bright people. And I’ve dealt with them for more than 40 years. They talk to

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themselves. They don’t talk to anybody else. They play game theory. In

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non-ooperative game theory, you don’t talk to the other side. You just make

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your strategy. This is the essence of game theory.

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It’s not negotiation theory. It’s not peacemaking theory.

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It is unilateral non-ooperative theory. If you know formal game theory,

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that’s what they play. It started at the Rand Corporation. That’s what they still play. In 2019, there’s a paper by Rand,

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how do we extend Russia? Do you know they wrote a paper which Biden followed?

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How do we annoy Russia? That’s literally the strategy. How do we

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annoy Russia? We’re trying to provoke it, trying to make it break apart, maybe

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have regime change, maybe have unrest, maybe have economic crisis.

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That’s what you call your ally. Are you kidding?

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So, I had a long and frustrating phone call with Sullivan.

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I was standing out in the freezing cold. I happened to be h trying to have a ski

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day and there I was. Jake, don’t have the war.

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Oh, there’ll be no war. Jeff, we know a lot of what happened the next

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month, which is that they refused to negotiate.

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The stupidest idea of NATO is the so-called open door policy.

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Are you kidding? NATO reserves the right to go where it wants without any

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neighbor having any say whatsoever? Well, I tell the Mexicans and the

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Canadians, don’t try it. You know, Trump may want to take over Canada. So,

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Canada could say to China, why don’t you build a military base uh in uh in in

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Ontario? I wouldn’t advise it. And the United States would not say,

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well, it’s an open door. That’s their business. I mean, they can do what they want. That’s not our business.

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But grown-ups in Europe, repeat this in Europe, in your commission, your high

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representative. This is nonsense stuff. This is not even

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baby geopolitics. This is just not thinking at all.

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So the war started. What was Putin’s intention in the war?

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I can tell you what his intention was. It was to force Zalinski to negotiate.

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Neutrality. And that happened within 7 days of the

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start of the invasion. You should understand this, not the

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propaganda that’s written about this. Oh, that they failed and he was going to take over Ukraine.

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Come on, ladies and gentlemen, understand something basic.

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The idea was to keep NATO, and what is NATO? It’s the United States,

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off of Russia’s border. No more, no less.

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I should add one very important point. Why

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are they so interested? first because if China or Russia decided to have a

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military base on the Rio Grand or in uh the Canadian border, not only would the

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United States freak out, we’d have war within about 10 minutes,

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but because the United States unilaterally abandoned the anti-bballistic missile treaty in 2002

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and ended the nuclear arms control framework by doing So, and this is

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extremely important to understand the nuclear arms control framework is

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based on trying to block a first strike. The ABM treaty was a critical component

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of that. The US unilaterally walked out of the ABM treaty in 2002.

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It blew a Russian gasket. So everything I’ve been describing is in the context

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of the destruction of the nuclear framework as well. And starting in 2010,

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the US put in Aegis missile systems in Poland and then in Romania.

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And Russia doesn’t like that. And one of the issues on the table in December and

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January, December 2021, January 2022 was does the United States claim the right

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to put missile systems in Ukraine? And Blinken told Lavrov in January 2022, the

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United States reserves the right to put middle missile systems wherever it wants.

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That’s your puditive ally. And now let’s put intermediate missile

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systems back in Germany. The United States walked out of the INF treaty unilaterally in 2019. There is no

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nuclear arms framework right now. None.

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When Zalinski said in seven days, let’s negotiate.

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I know the details of this exquisitly

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because I’ve talked to all the parties in detail.

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Within a couple of weeks, there was a document exchanged

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that President Putin had approved that Lavrov had presented that was being

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managed by the Turkish mediators. I flew to Anchora to listen in detail to

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what the mediators were doing. Ukraine walked away unilaterally from a

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near agreement. Why? Because the United States told them

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to. Because the UK added icing to the cake by having Bojo

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go in early April to Ukraine and explain and he has

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recently and if your security is in the hands of Boris Johnson, God help us all.

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Keith Starmer turns out to be even worse. It’s unimaginable but it is true.

38:23

Boris Johnson has explained and you can look it up

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on the website that what’s at stake here is western hegemony,

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not Ukraine, Western hegemony.

38:40

Michael and I met at the Vatican with a group in the spring of 2022 where we

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wrote a document explaining nothing good can come out of this war

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for Ukraine. Negotiate now because anything that takes time will mean

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massive amounts of deaths, risk of nuclear escalation, and likely loss of

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the war. I wouldn’t change one word from what we wrote then. Nothing was wrong in that

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document. And since that document, since the US talked the negotiators away from

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the table, about a million Ukrainians have died or

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been severely wounded. And the American senators who are as

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nasty and cynical and corrupt as imaginable say this is wonderful expenditure of our

39:37

money because no Americans are dying. It’s the pure proxy war. One of our

39:44

senators nearby me uh Blumenthal says this out loud.

39:51

Mitt Romney says this out loud. It’s best money America can spend. No

39:56

Americans are dying. It’s unreal.

40:02

Now, just to bring us up to yesterday,

40:08

this failed. This project failed. The idea of the project was that Russia

40:14

would fold its hand. The idea all along was Russia can’t

40:20

resist. As Ziggnub Brjinski explained in 1997,

40:26

the Americans thought we have the upper hand. We’re going to win because we’re going

40:32

to bluff them. They’re not really going to fight. They’re not really going to mobilize.

40:38

The nuclear option of cutting them out of Swift, that’s going to do them in. The economic

40:46

sanctions, that’s going to do them in. the Himars. That’s going to do them in.

40:53

The attackums, the F-16s.

40:59

Honestly, I’ve listened to this for 70 years. I’ve listened to it as

41:05

semiunderstanding, I’d say, for uh about 56 years. They speak nonsense every day.

41:12

My country, my government, this is so familiar to me.

41:19

completely familiar. I begged the Ukrainians and I had a track record with the Ukrainians. I advised the

41:26

Ukrainians. I’m not anti- Ukrainian. I’m pro- Ukrainian completely. I said, “Save

41:31

your lives. Save your sovereignty. Save your territory. Be neutral. Don’t listen

41:37

to the Americans.” I repeated to them the famous adage of

41:42

Henry Kissinger that to be an enemy of the United States is dangerous but to be

41:48

a friend is fatal. Okay, so let me repeat that for Europe.

41:54

To be an enemy of the United States is dangerous, but to be a friend is fatal.

42:02

So let me now finalize a few words about Trump.

42:11

Trump does not want the losing hand.

42:16

This is why it is more likely than not this war will

42:22

end because Trump and President Putin will

42:27

agree to end the war. If Europe does all its great

42:33

wararmongering, it doesn’t matter. The war is ending.

42:39

So get it out of your system. Please tell your colleagues

42:46

it’s over. And it’s over because Trump doesn’t want

42:52

to carry a loser. That’s it. It’s not some great morality.

42:59

He doesn’t want to carry a loser. This is a loser.

43:04

The one that will be saved by the negotiations taking place right now is Ukraine.

43:11

Second is Europe. Your stock markets rising in recent days, by the horrible

43:17

news of negotiations. I know this has been met with the sheer horror in these

43:23

chambers, but this is the best news that you could get.

43:30

Now, I encouraged, they don’t listen to me, but I tried to

43:36

reach out to some of the European leaders. Most don’t want to hear anything from me at all.

43:44

But I said, don’t go to Kiev. Go to Moscow.

43:51

Discuss with your counterparts. Are you kidding? You’re Europe, your 450

43:58

million people, your 20 trillion dollar economy. You should be the main economic trading

44:07

partner of Russia, its natural links.

44:12

By the way, if anyone would like to discuss how the US blew up Nordstream, I’d be happy to talk about that.

44:24

So the Trump administration is imperialist

44:30

at heart. It is a great powers

44:36

dominate the world. It is we will do what we want when we

44:42

can. We will be better than a scesscent

44:49

Biden and we’ll cut our losses where we have to.

44:55

There are several war zones in the world, the Middle East being another. We

45:00

don’t know what will happen with that. Again, if Europe had a proper policy,

45:06

you could stop that war. I’ll explain how.

45:11

But war with China is also a possibility.

45:17

So, I’m not saying that we’re at the new age of peace,

45:23

but we are in a uh very uh different kind of politics right

45:31

now. And Europe should have a foreign policy

45:36

and not just a foreign policy of rousophobia. a foreign policy that is a realistic

45:42

foreign policy that understands Russia’s situation, that understands Europe’s situation, that understands what America

45:50

is and what it stands for, that tries to

45:55

avoid Europe being invaded by the United States because it’s not impossible that America

46:03

will just land troops in Danish territory. I’m not joking.

46:10

And I don’t think they’re joking. And Europe needs a foreign policy, a real

46:16

one, not a yes, we’ll bargain with Mr.

46:21

Trump and meet him halfway. You know what that will be like? Give me

46:27

a call afterwards.

46:33

Please don’t have American officials as head of Europe. Have European officials,

46:41

please have a European foreign policy.

46:46

You’re going to be living with Russia for a long time, so please negotiate with Russia.

46:53

There are real security issues on the table. But the bombast and the rousophobia

47:02

is not serving your security at all. It’s not serving Ukraine security at

47:07

all. It contributed to a million casualties in Ukraine from this idiotic

47:14

American adventure that you signed on to and then became the lead cheerleaders of

47:21

solves nothing

47:26

on the Middle East. By the way, the US

47:32

completely handed over foreign policy to Netanyahu 30 years ago. The Israel lobby

47:39

dominates American politics. Just have no doubt about it. I could explain for

47:46

hours how it works. It’s very dangerous.

47:51

I’m hoping that Trump will not destroy his administration and worse the Palestinian people because

47:59

of Netanyahu, who I regard as a war criminal

48:05

uh properly indicted by the IC and that needs to be told no more that

48:14

there will be a state of Palestine on the borders of the 4th of June 1967.

48:20

according to international law as the only way for peace. It’s the only way

48:26

for Europe to have peace on your borders with the Middle East is the two-state

48:33

solution. There is only one obstacle to it, by the way, and that is the veto of

48:40

the United States and the UN Security Council. So if you want to have some influence, tell the United States, “Drop

48:48

the veto. You are together with 180 countries in

48:53

the world. The only ones that oppose a Palestinian state are

49:00

the United States, Israel, Micronisia, Nau, Pao,

49:08

Papa New Guinea, Mr. Malay

49:13

and Paraguay. So this is a place where Europe could

49:19

have a big influence. Europe has gone silent about the JCPOA

49:25

and Iran. Netanyahu’s greatest dream in life is a

49:30

war between the United States and Iran. He’s not given up. And it’s not impossible that that would come also.

49:39

And that’s because the US in this regard does not have an independent foreign

49:45

policy. It is run by Israel. It’s tragic.

49:50

It’s amazing. By the way, and it could end. Trump may say that he

49:58

wants foreign policy back. Maybe. I’m hoping that it’s the case. Finally, let

50:04

me just say with respect to China, China is not an enemy. China is just a success

50:11

story. That’s why it is viewed by the United States as an enemy because China

50:18

is a bigger economy than the United States.

50:23

That’s all. [Music]

50:53

[Music]

oooooo

The Unspoken Truth About Trump’s New Plan for Ukraine | Prof. Jeffrey Sachs

(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8Al3uZ7DUw)

Transkripzioa:

0:00

joins us now. Professor Saxs, always a pleasure, my dear friend. Great to be with you. Want to spend Thank you. I want to spend

0:06

a little time with you uh seeking your analysis on some rather dangerous things

0:12

the president of the United States has done and said lately. But before we get

0:17

there, uh I have an interest in this and I know you do and I know it’s one of

0:22

your fields of expertise and I know viewers are interested in it. What are the origins of American hostility

0:31

toward China? Why this hostility rather than compatibility?

0:37

Well, we had compatibility up until 10 years ago and then a conscious decision

0:44

was made to move to hostility. uh this was uh actually a contrived

0:51

move to try to stop China’s successful

0:57

economic development. The origins of of it are that from the 1970s

1:04

to around uh 2010, China was viewed as uh both a

1:13

constructive partner, a trade partner and geopolitically

1:18

helpful to the United States for quite a while. Remember when Richard Nixon went

1:24

to China, uh the idea was a kind of triangulation that there was the US cold

1:31

war with the Soviet Union by the US warming up with China. This would help

1:38

to put more pressure, it was thought, on the Soviet Union. So it was an instrumental idea that the US would get

1:46

closer to China. Starting in 1978, China undertook remarkable economic

1:54

reforms, arguably the most successful economic reforms in world history

2:00

because China went from being an impoverished economy in 1978

2:06

uh to being one of the most successful dynamic arguably uh currently the most

2:14

successful economy in the world today during a period of just a bit over 40

2:20

years. uh now during that time US China economic and political relations were

2:28

good for most of the period actually a lot of Americans were making a lot of

2:34

money by selling things to China or making investments in China or

2:39

integrating Chinese companies into global supply chains and America on the

2:46

whole benefited enormously from China’s economic growth Though some places in

2:53

America faced intense import competition from China and suffered, but others

2:59

boomed. California boomed, no question, as a result of the growing US China

3:05

trade. probably uh places in the industrial Midwest were hit by the uh

3:13

increasing competition from China, but net net uh the US China relations were

3:20

very positive. Now, starting around 2010, uh American strategists, I use that I

3:29

think it’s a euphemism because I think they’re idiots basically as as you know. I don’t think that they’re strategists

3:35

at all. But anyway, who’s the president uh in this time period?

3:40

That’s Obama. But it doesn’t matter. This is another point of American foreign policy. All this idea that oh,

3:47

we’ll see if it’s Clinton or Bush Jr. or Obama or Trump one or Biden or Trump 2.

3:54

This is not actually how foreign policy works. uh it’s the Pentagon, the CIA,

4:00

the deep state, the military-industrial complex. And starting around 2010, uh

4:06

these strategists said, “Oh my god, China’s too successful. We need to do

4:12

something.” In 2015, a very uh interesting article. horrible on one

4:19

level because I think it’s foolishness to the maximum but insightful also to

4:26

the maximum was written by a former colleague of mine ambassador Robert

4:32

Blackwell who was a professor at Harvard then a senior US diplomat and another

4:38

leading specialist Ashley Telus and the paper in 2015 was written for the

4:43

Council on Foreign Relations. you could put a link to it because I I believe it’s

4:50

openly available. And it declares bluntly that America’s goal or its grand

4:58

strategy is primacy. In other words, the grand strategy of the United States is

5:04

to be number one. And China’s rise, these authors say,

5:12

is a threat to America being number one. They don’t say China’s evil. They don’t

5:17

say China’s done something terrible. They don’t say uh that China is a threat

5:23

to US national security or prosperity. They say that China’s success is a

5:29

threat to the American grand strategy of being number one.

5:35

Okay. If you’re in a high school clique, maybe that’s your goal. If you’re

5:41

grown-ups in a in a world uh where there are dangers of nuclear war, where you

5:50

need cooperation, where there’s mutual gains from trade, the idea that being number one is a meaningful idea when

5:58

you’re 4% of the world population. And the idea that the success of another country is harmful to you because

6:07

they’re successful, not because of what they’re doing, but because of their successful

6:12

is to my mind so mind-bogglingly wrongheaded.

6:18

But that became the core of American policy. And in this very interesting paper, which I really would like people

6:26

to read with their own eyes because it’s incredible, says we must stop China.

6:32

It’s no longer in our interest for China to be successful. And they list all the

6:37

things we should do. For example, one of the incredibly stupid ideas was we

6:44

should have a trade arrangement for the US and Asian countries that excludes

6:49

China. It’s like uh kids on a you take a map, we put an X over China, but we

6:56

trade with all the others. Not noticing that all the others have their main trading partner, China. But Obama really

7:04

tried to do that. He tried to launch something called the Trans-Pacific Partnership, which was a trade group

7:12

that would exclude China. Okay, this was another one of these uh ideas that

7:19

belongs in the dust bin of history and it did never materialize. But the list

7:24

goes on. We should stop exporting uh technology. We should uh break

7:30

relations. We should increase our military uh bases around China’s

7:38

rimlands. we should do uh other things uh restrictions on investments uh trade

7:44

barriers. Why? Because America needs to be number one. So we have to do whatever

7:49

we can to harm China’s economy. Now

7:55

today uh I was just reading uh the typical columnists of uh the Washington

8:02

Post and the New York Times and Financial Times and every one of them

8:07

treats China like an enemy just naturally we have to prepare for war.

8:14

They’re an enemy. Uh we have to be smarter in our trade policy than Trump because uh China’s going to take an

8:21

advantage. Everything is not about American interests or American

8:26

well-being or the American people. It’s about this game.

8:32

Like it’s a board game. So you ask me why do we hate China? Because we were

8:38

told to starting 10 years ago because it became the strategy of the United States

8:45

to harm China. By the way, how do you think Chinese officials and government

8:51

and business feel about this? That another country is overtly aiming to

8:58

harm them. Is that conducive to to peace, to goodwill, to normal behavior,

9:06

to the security of the United States of America? Of course not. We’re provoking

9:13

and but it’s so clear from this article. People should read it. So this this is

9:18

the the basic point and I’ve I’ve been I just have to add I’ve been visiting

9:24

China since 1981. So uh 44 years I I’ve

9:30

toured all parts of the country. I’ve studied Chinese history extensively.

9:36

I’ve published about China. I’ve written very extensively about the Chinese

9:42

reforms. China is not an enemy. China is not doing anything to threaten American

9:49

security. There is no reason for the United States to view China’s well-being

9:55

as harmful to America’s interest. Nor did China’s rise hurt the United States.

10:02

But our political system is so broken that if major parts of the US benefit,

10:09

but one part, say the industrial Midwest, say in Ohio or Indiana hurts,

10:16

we don’t have a policy to help those people. Our policy is to attack China,

10:22

even though the overall relationship is mutually beneficial. So, by the way,

10:28

every day there’s a drum beat of war right now. on our side. Uh I was in China, by the

10:35

way, recently uh just a couple of weeks ago. They just look on in amazement.

10:43

What is going on in your country? What is it? What is this hostility? Why does

10:48

the president fulminate every day about us? That’s what they ask. I wish the

10:55

president listen to you. I wish the Congress could listen to you. Professor Saxs, two months ago, the Secretary of

11:02

Defense, who has his own issues, was in Japan and was threatening China.

11:07

They’re all threatening every day. And I and these incredibly awful columnist Max Boot today, I’ll

11:16

name names in in the Washington Post. It’s it’s just pure wararmongering. Now,

11:21

of course, he supported every war we’ve been in because that’s our columnists. They’re just wararm mongers. But the

11:28

next war they want is with China. Good luck with that. What is the what is the

11:34

matter with our country? Can we just along with somebody? Is there any reason from an economic

11:40

perspective? One of your other fields of expertise, Professor Saxs, that we can’t

11:46

just have an open trading policy with China. They can sell us what they want and we can buy what we want and we can

11:52

sell whatever they want to buy from us. Of course. And when they out compete us in certain areas like they are doing

11:59

right now in electric vehicles, it’s because the United States has no policy.

12:06

You know, Trump just pul pulled the plug literally on electric vehicles and on

12:12

and on the incentives and so forth. Okay, we handed China the world market

12:18

for electric vehicles and then we say, “Oh, they’ve got over capacity in electric vehicles because they’re

12:25

selling electric vehicles all over the world.” Then we have to put up tariff barriers because we have no sensible

12:32

industrial policy whatsoever. And so this this is uh not China’s

12:38

fault. China is just diligently following the future, developing new efficient energy

12:46

sources, 5G technology, open-source AI, fourth generation nuclear power. I

12:54

toured factories recently, incredible integration of artificial intelligence

13:01

systems and robotics in highly sophisticated solar module factories.

13:08

Incredible what I saw. Yeah. And we complain. They’re just doing a good job

13:13

in manufacturing. What What is Trump doing? Trump is attacking the

13:18

universities, cutting the research budgets, uh driving scientists from the

13:25

United States to China or to other parts of the world, and then whining about all

13:31

those terrible things the other countries are doing to us, all that unfairness.

13:36

Well, Professor Saxs, President Trump shoots the messenger. If you’re the

13:43

director of the Bureau of Labor Statistics and the statistics are bad for a month and you reveal them and he

13:49

doesn’t like what you reveal, even though what you revealed is based on an algorithm, you’re fired.

13:55

That’s the mentality we’re dealing with. But, by the way,

14:00

Trump Okay, that’s that is like a 5-year-old. I I don’t I don’t like the

14:05

news. So I uh just throw everything into turmoil. But what’s amazing is not that

14:12

that we might have expected. What is amazing is the silence in Washington.

14:19

This is this is how our country is supposed to be that you get a month of

14:26

bad data and then you fire the person in charge of the Bureau of Labor

14:31

Statistics. And by the way, there always are revisions to the data. This is a

14:38

core and systematic and scientific part of how to measure a complex $30 trillion

14:46

economy. But what struck me first was the silence. Where are the Congress

14:52

people saying, “No, we can’t run a country on the the most shoddy whims.”

14:59

But then the chairman of the council of economic adviserss comes out and defends

15:05

the firing of the commissioner of the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Yes.

15:10

Honestly, we are completely destroying our institutions before our

15:18

eyes. The only word that characterizes

15:23

Washington, and I’m I’m speaking beyond Trump himself, is pathetic.

15:30

Nobody speaks the truth. No one says that this completely erratic and

15:36

dangerous behavior is very uh damaging to our national security. We had the

15:44

president shooting off about nuclear this and that in the last few

15:50

days. Just unbelievable. Here’s what he said. And and this is in in response to

15:56

a tweet based on the highly provocative statements of the former president.

16:01

Chris, can you put it up? Based on the highly provocative

16:07

statements of the former president of Russia, Dimmitri Medvidev, who is now the deputy chairman of the security

16:12

council of the Russian Federation, I have ordered two nuclear submarines to

16:17

be positioned in the appropriate regions. Just in case these foolish and inflammatory statements are more than

16:24

just that. Words are very important and can often lead to unintended consequences. I hope this will not be

16:30

one of those instances. Thank you for your attention to this matter. talk about being being uh foolish with words.

16:38

Why would you do this? And why would you announce it? And why would you provoke another nuclear power that has three or

16:44

four times the number of nuclear submarines that we do? And and the reason that this

16:54

unbelievable uh posting occurred was in response to a

17:00

posting by Medved which was in response to an ultimatum delivered by Trump to

17:09

President Putin that if you don’t have a ceasefire in 10 days, I impose the

17:16

sanctions on all countries in the world that are dealing with you. Ultimatum to Russia rather than actual

17:27

diplomacy. Good luck with that

17:32

ultimatum. An ultimatum. You know, the problem is Trump is of course he has no

17:39

attention span, maybe no understanding, no knowledge of what he’s doing.

17:45

But the fact of the matter is there’s no diplomacy taking place right now because

17:51

the war in Ukraine that he promised to end in 24 hours, which by the way could

17:57

have been ended in 24 hours, not on the basis of an ultimatum or declaring you

18:03

must have a ceasefire, but on the basis of solving the underlying issue that led

18:10

us to this war. And this war, as every

18:16

analyst you talk to says, and as everyone who has looked clearly into

18:22

this, understands, came because we pushed NATO up to

18:27

Russia’s borders. because we overthrew a government in Ukraine

18:34

so that that new government would support NATO because the government we overthrew wanted neutrality which is a

18:41

no no in American eyes and because the United States resisted every attempt at

18:49

diplomacy to avoid the war and then to end the war. We absolutely threw out the

18:56

agreement at the UN called the Mins 2 agreement that would have avoided this war telling the Ukrainians you don’t

19:03

have to abide by the UN security council and an agreement that the Ukraine itself had signed

19:10

and then when there was a peace agreement reached just about to be reached in April 2022 the US government

19:18

told the Ukrainians no you fight on we don’t want you neutral We want you on our side. No neutrality.

19:27

So Trump now gives an ultimatum that doesn’t get to any of the root causes of

19:34

this conflict. Of course, the ultimatum is not going to be uh observed, but he’s

19:40

giving an ultimatum to a nuclear superpower. But more than that, he’s telling China, India, Brazil, and all

19:48

the other countries of the world that the United States demands that they stop

19:54

trading with Russia as well. Well, fancy that. You think that’s going

20:00

to work? That the United States that the president of the United States can just

20:05

dictate to the whole world what to do? No. That is not how conflicts are

20:13

resolved. That’s not how diplomacy works. That’s not, and this is the most

20:19

important point, that’s not how American security is achieved. Trump is driving

20:26

America into the greatest insecurity that we have had

20:31

in decades, certainly since uh the worst moments of the Cold War, if not worse

20:37

than that right now. by this obstreporous uh vituprative

20:43

uh unstable non or anti- diplomacy that we’re

20:50

engaged in. Sit and talk and resolve serious issues like grown-ups,

20:57

not this shooting off in the most provocative

21:04

possible ways. But again, I have to emphasize Trump does it.

21:10

It’s disgusting and it’s shocking. But in Washington, no one says anything else

21:17

because it’s as if the rest of the constitutional order has disappeared in the United States. Professor Saxs, did

21:25

the United States government in the past uh two weeks announce that it had just

21:31

completed the delivery of nuclear weapons to NATO countries?

21:37

I I can’t tell you uh actually I can’t tell you authoritatively

21:43

uh and and I don’t know authoritatively uh on such a a crucial question but I

21:49

know you have many interlocators who can give a an authoritative answer. I appreciate uh your cander there.

21:56

Tomorrow’s New York Times uh has an article by the uh New York Times bureau

22:02

chief in Jerusalem. It’s highly critical of Prime Minister Netanyahu, but the

22:09

opening line is so curious. When Benjamin Netanyahu, the Israeli

22:15

Prime Minister, led the country to a military victory over Iran in June,

22:23

what military victory over Iran in June is the New York Times talking about?

22:30

Every day I decide to cancel my subscription to the New York Times and

22:37

every day I pull back just because I I need at least to see the foolishness so

22:43

that I understand what others are hearing. Of course, there was no

22:48

military victory. We are in a much deeper crisis than we were before the

22:54

so-called 12-day war. The IAEA, the International Atomic Energy Agency, was

23:02

pushed out of Iran. There is no diplomacy. You see, everything judge is coming from

23:11

the basic point that the American delusion and it’s not just Trump,

23:18

although he has his particular way. the American delusion,

23:25

let me just add say Lindsey Graham or Richard Blumenthal, but it’s everywhere

23:31

that the United States can dictate all terms to all of the rest of the world.

23:38

And that is true whether it’s in Iran, this 12-day war, we bomb when we want,

23:44

we make demands of diplomacy when we want. uh or uh true in Ukraine or true

23:52

uh visav China or true visa v India’s trade with Russia you name it you know

24:00

the the the one leader in the world who said it most clearly just very

24:07

succinctly because he’s a brilliant leader and communicator is Brazil’s

24:12

president Lula who said very matterof factly

24:17

we don’t need an emperor. And he was referring, of course, to all

24:24

the threats that Trump had made against Brazil. Uh

24:30

Trump telling the independent Brazilian judiciary uh to stop a a court case, if you can

24:38

imagine. And uh Lula said we don’t need an emperor, but we have

24:46

we have we have an emperor right now and we don’t have a constitutional order. Uh

24:51

and uh we have growing crises all over the world.

24:56

And and the the biggest culprit is a supine Congress that does nothing, lets

25:05

the president impose taxes, looks the other way, doesn’t complain about anything. As you pointed out earlier,

25:11

the silence from Congress, I I just don’t uh I just don’t get it.

25:17

We we used to know of senators who were personalities and would speak to the

25:24

country and uh actually advise the nation about the right way

25:32

forward. We had debates in Washington, sometimes very heated debates, but

25:38

sometimes very illuminating debates. We have nothing right now. We have

25:44

executive orders where one person declares emergencies.

25:52

We have silence from the Congress as if it doesn’t exist at all. We have a

26:00

Supreme Court that basically shades its eyes and turns away and lets this

26:07

destruction of the constitutional order proceed. We have uh spokespeople

26:16

completely unqualified, knowing nothing,

26:22

opining on uh the gravest matters of international

26:28

relations because they’re they’re in the White House

26:35

without any responsibility. I’m I don’t even want to name names. It’s so ugly the things that have been coming out of

26:42

the White House in in in the last few days and the idiocy of it of people who know nothing about the world except that

26:49

they’re making the world far more dangerous every single day.

26:55

Not to raise your blood pressure, but I believe that shortly before we came on air, the Israeli government announced

27:02

the firing of the attorney general of Israel, who was the principal prosecutor

27:08

of Netanyahu. Now, this will obviously go before the Israeli Supreme Court, and there’ll be another uh Israeli

27:15

constitutional crisis. Uh yeah whether Israel survives all of this

27:22

we don’t know because it is in the process of self-destructing undermining

27:28

the most most basic legitimacy of the state in an orgy of murder uh in an orgy

27:34

of genocide uh where the ministers of the government have

27:41

left any even slightest compunction about talking about genocide openly And

27:48

uh the United States is completely complicit in this completely. And again,

27:55

Trump’s our president, so he’s complicit in it. But it goes far beyond Trump. It is the uh completely compromised

28:03

American political class.

28:10

Mike Huckabe, my former colleague at Fox News. Every

28:15

time you turn around, there’s somebody that used to work at Fox being given a significant position in the government

28:22

was allowed to visit Gaza. And of course, the person he spoke to was healthy, happy, well-dressed, and said

28:29

all the right things to him, and he came on and uh and repeated that. I don’t

28:35

know how any of this ends. Uh, Professor Saxs, Trump has only been in office for uh eight months. I share every one of

28:42

your uh criticisms against them except that people are dying

28:48

dying horrible horrific deaths and nothing seems to come of it. What will

28:54

come of Great Britain, France, Canada, a

28:59

few other countries, I think Spain, maybe Portugal recognizing a Palestinian

29:04

state. I don’t think anything until the UN Security Council does it. Am I right?

29:09

Well, we have right now 150 countries that have recognized the state of

29:14

Palestine. They represent uh around 90%

29:20

of the world population. I need to do an update of the arithmetic, but basically

29:27

90 plus% of the world population says there needs to be a state of Palestine

29:33

alongside the state of Israel. There was a declaration by the Arab countries

29:39

saying that Hamas would be disarmed, that there would be a normalization of

29:46

relations on the basis of a state of Palestine alongside the state of Israel. Uh, of

29:54

course, Israel rejected that. This is what’s important for everybody to

29:59

understand. Israel is not looking for peace. Israel

30:04

is looking for domination. This government and much of Israeli

30:11

society is absolutely content on mass murder and on ethnic cleansing so that

30:18

Israel retains control over 100%

30:24

of what was uh the so-called British mandatory Palestine. In other words, uh

30:30

the land that Britain in its typical imperialistic way promised to everybody,

30:38

to the Arabs, to the Jews, to the French, to everybody. Uh and uh the

30:45

Zionists said, “We’ll take it all.” And they don’t want peace based on two

30:51

states. They want everything. And since there just happened to be some millions

30:57

of Arabs living there, they’re just going to have to leave or starve to death or be killed or submit to a

31:06

parttheid rule. That’s all that’s going on. There is no attempt at in the United

31:13

States and or Israel to actually make peace. But for

31:21

90% of the world, what’s happening is ab abhorrent. And for most of American

31:28

citizens who of course play no role in our government in foreign policy whatsoever, no voice, no say, no

31:36

reflection of our attitudes, we are revolted by Israel’s

31:44

extraordinarily uh cruel

31:51

I don’t I I lose the words, but it is a genocide and and and and and just to say

31:58

we’re it’s two countries now and you ask will something come of this yes in the

32:04

end there will be a state of Palestine how many people die beforehand is the

32:10

real question but there absolutely will be a state of Palestine there is a question will there be a state of Israel

32:15

because if Israel is so shockingly

32:21

disgustingly brazen in this mass murder How is Israel going to go on among the

32:28

community of nations? That’s the real question. Here’s Senator Tim Kaine of Virginia who

32:34

agrees with you and regrettably Secretary of State Marco Rubio who does

32:40

not. Chris, back to back two and three. The the international community,

32:45

including the United States, made a promise in 1947 that there would be a state of Israel and a state for Arabs,

32:52

Palestine, in this space. One promise has been met. Nearly 80 years later, one

32:57

promise has not been met. More than a hundred nations have done a recognition. They’ve said, “Look, we need to meet the

33:03

promise that the international community made. But it needs to be conditionsbased.” And I think the most

33:08

important condition is recognizing a Palestine when they are able to

33:13

peacefully coexist with their neighbors, including Israel. And so as I read what the nations are saying, it’s not a an

33:21

immediate recognition, no questions asked, in September. It’s establishing conditions um that when they are met,

33:28

Palestine would be recognized. The UK is like, well, if Israel doesn’t agree to a ceasefire by September, we’re going to

33:34

recognize a Palestinian state. So if I’m Hamas, I say, you know what, let’s not allow there to be a ceasefire. If Hamas

33:39

refuses to agree to a ceasefire, it guarantees a Palestinian state will be recognized by all these countries in

33:45

September. So, they’re not going to agree to a ceasefire. I mean, it’s so clumsy.

33:51

It It’s hard to know whether these people like Rubio are so dense that they

33:58

don’t understand anything or so vulgar that they obfuscate everything. But

34:05

Rubio’s not working towards a twostate solution. No. What’s his complaint? Do your diplomacy.

34:12

That’s your job, Mr. Secretary of State, do your diplomacy,

34:19

but you’re not doing any diplomacy. So, who are you to say what other

34:24

countries should do? Because you and your administration is not engaged in

34:29

diplomacy. It’s engaged in war. War is not diplomacy.

34:35

Diplomacy is finding a way to peace. What are you doing, Mr. Rubio, to find a way to peace and a two-state solution?

34:42

Nothing. So every word that Rubio utters is

34:48

either this measure of how dense he might be or how much he wants to

34:55

obuscate the most basic point that we are complicit in a genocide and do not

35:02

find words for diplomacy which 150 other countries have easily

35:09

recognized. And by the way, that’s 150 that have recognized Palestine. More than 180 have repeatedly voted for

35:18

Palestinian right to political self-determination at the UN year after

35:24

year. That I know the count because I’ve done the arithmetic. It’s 95%

35:30

of the world population. Do you think that the arguments that you’ve made are even articulated in the

35:38

White House? No, I think the uh

35:44

militaryindustrial state which runs our country

35:50

lives in a delusion of being all powerful and

35:57

thinking that whenever there’s resistance all they have to do is escalate more arms, more military, more

36:05

war so that they can dictate. This has been like this for a long time. Again, I

36:11

don’t find anything particular with Trump except how obnoxious things are put. But Biden was terrible. Trump won

36:20

same way. Obama terrible. Bush terrible. Bush Jr. This is why none

36:28

of these problems get solved. It’s not just that Trump’s not solving them.

36:34

The military-industrial state, as Eisenhower told us, took over our country by the mid 1960s, probably with

36:43

the coup in which President Kennedy was assassinated. And since then, we don’t have public

36:51

opinion on foreign policy. We don’t have American security interests. We just

36:56

have war. And the war is based on a delusion that we’re the most powerful so that we can dictate terms to everyone

37:03

else. So no, I don’t think that these arguments are discussed or debated because there is no discussion or debate

37:10

in Washington. None. By the way, there’s an article today of

37:15

some senators saying how unhappy they are in the Senate and they say there’s no debate in the Senate anymore. There

37:23

isn’t. I used to work in the Senate a long time ago, 5 uh uh 52 years ago uh when I was

37:33

a kid. Uh I saw real debate. There’s no debate right now. So no, the things

37:39

we’re discussing, they’re not discussed at all. They’re too arrogant and too ignorant even to have the discussion.

37:47

Professor Saxs, even when you’re angry, you are over-the-top articulate and so

37:53

informative. Thank you very much for uh all of this. I didn’t mean to raise your blood pressure, but God bless you. Thank

38:00

you for your understanding and your ability to explain that understanding to all of us. And we’ll look forward to

38:06

seeing you again soon. See you next week. Thanks a lot. Byebye.

38:11

Fabulous. Coming up tomorrow, Tuesday, at 8 in the morning, Ambassador Charles

38:17

Freeman at 2 in the afternoon, Aaron Mate. He had 3:00 in the afternoon.

oooooo