Palestina: erresilientzia (7)

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Al Jazeera English@AJEnglish

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Double Down News@DoubleDownNews

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Jake Shields@jakeshieldsajj

eka. 1

If you don’t see it by now you are a fucking idiot

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since October 7th I mean everything’s been destroyed and hamas’s message that we

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suffer with the people is resonating that we come from the people Hamas also

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has uh you know its zakat committees its social Aid committees which have won a

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lot of Goodwill they’ve brought people Aid they’ve been more efficient than the Palestinian Authority as a municipal

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Authority uh they’ve been less corrupt and I could I could be proven WR but I would expect as long as Biden’s

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in there many more provocations to come between now and November particularly

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possibly an October surprise on behalf of trump you know the intercept came in late in the game and started um

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definitely stealing a lot of credit for what we did although they later credited us

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[Music] hello and welcome to another episode of India and Global Life today we have with

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us a very special guest Max blumint Max is an author of several books and an

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American journalist he is the editor of the gry Zone which is well known for his critique of US foreign policy among

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other things Max welcome to Indian Global left so max I wanted to start

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with uh what’s going on in in Gaza we have seen two things in particular in uh

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in this month um um firstly the Seas and the shelling of

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Rafa earlier millions of people from North Gaza and but also darel Mah and

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hanun were pushed into the southern tip of the Rafa City and now they are being bombarded uh unra recently said that

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32,000 people have already fled from Rafa I don’t know where they have fled to but we have also seen uh renewed

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bombardment of zabala and other places in uh in in in in north of Gaza

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um hospitals like Alaska and Alda are at the verge of collapse so as an opening

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statement can you uh tell us a little bit about what’s going on in Gaza at the

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moment well it depends on who you ask

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um if you really want to know what’s going on the Israelis will present veral different

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narratives that are wildly different from what you’re getting from the Palestinians so I’ll try to unpack the

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different perspectives on what’s going on um from the perspective of the Palestinian civilian in Gaza what’s

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happening is a kind of a nightmare where they’re constantly having to pack up and flee

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every month or so and they’re trying to figure out where the most stable area is

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where they particularly the population from the north which has lost

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about um at least 700,000 residents who are constantly on the Move many of them

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fled All the Way South to Rafa and then their tents just got torched in the maasi area which Israel said was a safe

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Zone by these small diameter bombs provided by the us because the US said if Israel uses smaller bombs they’ll

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kill less people and they carried out one of the most heinous massacres just because it burned people alive by

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setting their tank their their tents on fire and so that area has been cleared out um and I think Israel’s deliberately

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attacking these Refugee areas to try to force them to go to a place like darlala

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in the Central Area because they want to get in deeper with their ground

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forces the Israeli perspective on Rafa is that there are four Hamas battalions

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and all the hostages are being held there and Netanyahu needs a win uh he

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needs to show Victory and basically dangle it in the

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face of all of his haters who are circling the wagons who who are um circling like sharks around him in

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Israel in Israeli politics he says that you know we’re going to free the

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Liberate the hostages we’re going to eliminate the remaining four Hamas battalions but none of this is happening

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and we can see the military failure of Israel through what’s taking place in jabalia all the way in in the north

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where it claimed an operational hold in January and that it said that it had

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eliminated as a cohesive unit the Hamas battalions in that area or Battalion and

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Israel is now taking a lot of losses there they’re back uh there’s heavy

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fighting all the time and they’re unable to dislodge the alasam brigades and the

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ALDS Sarah Al Goods uh the armed wing of Palestinian Islamic Jihad as well as the

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other factions they’re just unable to do it in jabalia so the idea that they could do it in Rafa is ridiculous but

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that’s what they’re trying to do the Israelis are claiming some sort of victory in south of

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Rafa because they’ve gotten a hold of what’s known as the Philadelphia Corridor between Rafa and what used to

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be the Egyptian side of Rafa before CeCe blew all those homes up but what what is the Egyptian side and they’re claiming

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that they are cut off the oxygen lines to Hamas that they found 27

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tunnels and that they’re going to fully suffocate Gaza I don’t believe them at all because

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they’ve been lying this whole time not just lying about massacr claiming they were mistakes but lying about their

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military successes they’ve been back to alifa hospital in Gaza City twice to supposedly clear out Hamas operatives

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there they’ll probably be back again it’s just kind of an endless war

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Israel’s National Security adviser Zaki hanegby who’s the um one of the closest confidants of

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Netanyahu in Israeli politics has said that the war will continue into next year his Deputy whose name is yuram

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hamoo resigned because he said that the war has no plan there’s no clear

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strategy and it could be going on for several years and that the hostages will not be released for several years and

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then you have the political situation in Israel where Netanyahu is being protested in the

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streets by the families of the hostages because they say correctly that

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Netanyahu does not want to negotiate for the release and have a ceasefire because that would mean the

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end of his not only the end of his career but he will face harsh consequences once he leaves office he

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loses amnesty for all of these corruption trials he faces he was going to trial before he was elected and

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formed a government he’ll go back to trial and though and in netanyahu’s thugs the lud party thugs

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are actually going out and attacking these families two days ago a parent of one of the hostages in Gaza was pepper

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sprayed in the face by one of netanyahu’s hooligans so the hostage issue is destabilizing Israeli politics

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Israel is failing militarily Palestinian civilians are suffering enormously uh

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because they they have really nowhere to live uh and the aid is failing to go in

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so right now is another period of famine where there’s only only canned food

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available in lots of areas uh fresh fruit hasn’t been available in central Gaza for like three weeks um but the

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Palestinian civilian population seems to be behind the

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resistance which is has lured Israel into a kind of political trap uh and

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none of Israel’s supposed milit successes are are uh will will last for

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more than a few weeks um so where where can this go it looks like to me I mean

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maybe you know people will come back to this interview and watch it in a few months

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or in a few years and what I’m saying will just seem like I’m you know talking about current events contemporary

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Affairs but we we’re witnessing the uh rapid

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erosion not just of the credit ability of Israel on the world stage but of the viability of the Zionist system because

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the Zionist system requires a leader who has credibility

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domestically uh Netanyahu does have that to some degree he he might be unpopular

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as a whole but he’s the most popular figure in Israel and he’s been around for a long time and he’s able to form a

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coalition that includes the furthest of the far right uh with other he he could

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even form a coalition with uh you know Centrist figures and you know the at the

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same time you have to have someone in Israel who can also be kind of a Salesman of Zionism on the world stage

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and Netanyahu has mastered that he comes from the United States he speaks perfect English he understands the US political

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system he has you know donors in his back pocket who are ready to uh manipulate both you know both parties so

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nany is sort of a unique figure and there’s no one after him who can fill that role there is no real towering

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figure like Netanyahu so when Netanyahu leaves the stage Israel’s crisis will

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deepen it’s unclear what will happen with the hostages but based on what I’m seeing right

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now they will either die because of starvation as or uh die from Israeli

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bombings die from the same conditions that Palestinians are dying in or there will be a major deal and Hamas

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is holding firm to its terms of the deal a total ceasefire and it wants top

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security prisoners to be released which has been a red line for Israel including people like Marwan baruti so if if Hamas

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gets the deal that will destabilize Israeli politics enormously and lead to

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the demise not just of Netanyahu but probably of the leud party if there’s no

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deal and the hostages die Netanyahu is also doomed because he allowed he just allowed them to die for

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his own personal narcissistic political to fulfill his own narcissistic

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political objectives so there doesn’t seem to be any way out for Israel’s current leadership and I think this will

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hasten the destabilization of Israeli society and politics um and we you know

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I haven’t even gotten into the dynamic DCS of a possible Civil War within Israel but that also seems

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possible in terms of popularity of nyaho I mean I read a recent PE research

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report uh at alira that’s found that and this is prior to the uh seizing of Rafa

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Which F which said basically 68% of Israelis think that what they are doing

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with the Palestinians are are good so it’s it’s not necessarily about n

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also also Gideon Levy today wrote that uh even without Gans Netanyahu would be

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having like 64 seats uh in in in in their legislature so his his government

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might not fall even without someone like uh G um I wanted to ask uh since you

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mentioned about uh the peace processes and also um Egypt in particular uh it

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seems that there is a huge pressure on States like Egypt and Jordan in particular from

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their own population regarding what has been going on in in in in Palestine and

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they seem to be um they seem to be in a hard position I mean there is a reported

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Talk phone call between Biden and LCC to sort of smooth the relation strained

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relationship between Israel and uh Egypt I wanted to ask you how do you see the

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role of uh States like Egypt and Jordan which on one hand doesn’t support the Muslim Brotherhood which uh you know

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does everything with the US that it likes but also is part of the peace process uh uh in in so many ways how do

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you see their role well their role is to essentially

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prop up to to provide Israel with strategic depth and uh an elite within their

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society receives favors from the west and guarantees of stability and their

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population can maintain some level of stability and be free from Israeli and

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Western violence as well as all of the uh toxins that come with it like Isis

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infestation that’s sort of been the the agreement since Camp David was

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authorized in 1979 between Egypt and netanyahu’s

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predecessor manum Bean his sort of in ideological

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forefather um that Arrangement is eroding as well I mean we saw an egypti

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an Egyptian Soldier get shot on the border of Rafa by an Israeli soldier

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just 48 hours ago uh the Egyptians are Furious but what can they do Egypt has a

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massive debt crisis the currency is in freef

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fall the society is growing rapidly the population’s growing rapidly and there’s

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less and less that the state can provide them without the support of the West and then you have the sort of upper middle

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class that’s been created by Camp David which is hostile to Palestinians the

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military Elite which controls at least one-third of the economy controls tourism controls so much of the uh

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Egyptian GDP that their entire their entire economy the entire

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economy that supports the people who make the decisions and provide the base

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for CCE to serve and which supported the coup that destroyed the first

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democratically elected government in 5,000 years in Egypt Muslim Brotherhood government which led to the killing the

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slow motion killing of the elected president Muhammad morsy in prison That Base that constituency cannot imagine

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imagine a life without Camp David without this relationship this cold

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peace with Israel that guarantees all the US military aid everything that comes with it including some measure of

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stability and stability is Paramount for Abdullah or CeCe or their

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constituents so while we’re seeing an erosion of their relations with the West

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I don’t really see anything changing there one reason that Jordan helped take down Iranian

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ballistic missiles was because they’re basically hosting so many US military

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bases both openly and secretly and that is really the key for

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Jordan to survive I mean I i’ I’ve spent a decent amount of time in both Egypt and Jordan when you get out of Cairo or

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you get out of Aman you see almost nothing but poverty Ian I guess Egypt

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has Alexandria and a few other cities but it’s extremely poor uh those cities

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depend heavily on Western investment and and the NGO class and of course as I

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said military aid Abdullah is ruling over millions of Palestinians and they understand that uh

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during the Arab Spring for example I was there they understood that Jordan was keeping the lights on whereas Syria was

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being destabilized by a dirty war Isis was infested areas of Iraq and Syria and

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they were hosting uh tens and tens of thousands of Syrian refugees at camps in the desert

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right over the Syrian border so their biggest fear was to be destabilized like those other countries uh Lebanon had

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that fear as well and Abdullah through his apparently through his agreements with the

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West because OB it was obvious the West Was controlling Al-Qaeda and Isis and

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along with turkey and partner uh you know they kept them out so I think there are all these barriers

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we have to consider before the population the will of the population of Egypt and Jordan can actually be

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actually be realized Visa Israel and um those barriers really speak to

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the um the kind of the the bare life conditions that so many people in the

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Middle East have uh that that have been imposed on

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them since the demise of Arab nationalism yeah talking about Arab

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nationalism and also stabilizing agents I think the other entity or element uh is the

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Palestinian Authority about which I wanted to ask you because one of the things that hasn’t been discussed a lot

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in the media or hasn’t hit the headlines is the continued atrocity in the West

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Bank I mean more than 500 people are killed in the West Bank since October um

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smart trats has been constantly talking about SM snapping um the Palestinian

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banking system from the Israeli banking system which would lead to collapse of currency collapse of Palestinian

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businesses that are very import important for import export trade um

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gallant and others are talking about um legalizing settlements uh in in areas

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nor of uh uh the West Bank uh and also there are talks about withhold of tax by

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Israel is in the settlement area um there are two views about the

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Palestinian Authority one is the New York Times Thomas fredman kind of view that if somehow Hamas goes and if

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Netanyahu goes as if under the negotiated process by Palestinian

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Authority on one hand and some moderate government in Israel on the other hand would lead us to the bring up peace and

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then there is the more um other side uh starting with people like Edward S and

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many many who are associated with the Palestinian solidarity and the resistance movement who saw the

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architects of Oslo uh to have betrayed uh the Palestinian nationalist cause

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what are your views of the Palestinian Authority well Oso was sort of an

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extension of Camp David where it seemed to offer an olive

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branch from the West to the Arab world and seemed to offer them the promise of more autonomy but what it actually did

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was lock them into an agreement that not only politically but also economically

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in locked them in to a system of permanent

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suppression uh self-suppression in a way where certain class was

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rewarded uh as the deao vichi author

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to keep the rest of the population in a kind of panopticon and financially I mean through the Paris protocols the

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Palestinian Authority the population of the West Bank was locked into a system of neoliberalism which also enabled

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Israel to become their tax collector and Israel can withhold taxes collected by

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the Palestinian Authority and say hey you can’t have your own Revenue unless you bow

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down um you have so much of the population now in the West Bank in debt

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um that’s part of the neoliberal Paris protocol system the agricultural economy has been destroyed through Oso and the

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Paris protocols and much of the agricultural land has been chewed up by settlements uh in area C you know Oslo

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established these three areas within the West Bank area a the densely populated urban areas which are under full

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Palestinian Authority control area B which is mixed control between Israel and the PA which means Israeli control

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and area C full Israeli control and the idea was at some point they’re going to negotiate and and it will all become one

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Palestinian state but of course Israel was never going to do that so area C is just filled with the most fanatical

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settlements and the settlers function as a kind of proxy Force for the military

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carrying out these I mean right now they’re officially becoming part of the military they’ve been given American M4

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rifles and uniforms and they’re going on and terrorizing all the population outside of area a so you have entire

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Villages across the West Bank now that are abandoned that was all that because of Oslo so Edward S it his warning was

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like the final warning uh and it was really important for him it’s really important to go back

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and read what he wrote at that time because he predicted everything that would happen that everything that’s

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happening now it’s no reason it’s it’s no surprise yaser Arafat actually had his book banned from bookstores in rala

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and I think there were some raids of bookstores that carried his book so you know when I’ve been in rala I’ve spent a

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lot of time there I’d be you know riding in a cafe and some heavys set British

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guys would come in or American guys and order a bunch of you know meats and food

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sit down drink be drinking beers these were security contractors from mercenary

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firms like dinec that were training the Palestinian Authority and making them

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into a force whose only role was to repress Palestinians who engaged in

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resistance last night I think it was last night Palestine time uh Israeli

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forces were in the middle of romala in those same areas where I was you know hanging out in cafes in Manara square

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and they were raiding Palestinian homes they were tear gassing people they set in entire Fruit Market vegetable market

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on fire uh with their uh weapons and the Palestinian Authority of course they’re

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nowhere to be found and in some cases what the Palestinian Authority does is they work handing glove with Israeli

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Security Forces for example there was a car ramming attack of Israeli soldiers who were terrorizing Palestinians around

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nablas two soldiers died and the perpetrator handed himself into the Palestinian Authority which promptly

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handed him over to the Israelis that’s how it works uh in the bolata refugee camp in

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nais which I visited several times during the day the Palestinian Authority

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patrols arrest people uh who are involved in resistance activities during the night the Israelis

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come in they’re they’re basically changing shifts so everyone sees what

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the Palestinian Authority is in the West Bank but then again it’s a question of stability you have Janine in the north

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where the Palestinian authorities lost control resistance factions are operating they’re fighting the Israelis they’re

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outgunned uh but they’re fighting them every day also in uh taram in the

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refugee camps around tarum there are regular gunfights with the Israelis and that’s the choice that’s presented to

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the average Palestinian resident of the West Bank is do you want to be like Janine where Israel is actually starting

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to operate with attack aircraft drop bombs in Janine bring bulldozers in to

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destroy the central areas um you know terrorize your population or do you want

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to be like rala the five-star occupation where you can it it seems usually like

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you’re in a normal Arab City anywhere in the Arab world until you leave and then you’re surrounded by walls and

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settlements uh and you can see like the settlement of sagot and its Winery which exports wine abroad within rala do you

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want I mean what is your choice they’re pretty bad choices um but what do you

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choose and you know having been in Gaza it’s the population just thinks differently

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they’ve been conditioned they’ve been they’ve grown up under different conditions and they’re proud of the

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choice that they’ve made to resist with weapons they’re proud to have military

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um military parades through the center of Gaza City with a military that

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actually fights whereas in rala the parades there would be like old oldtime

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fata fighters who used to fight and then uh civil servants and like children

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twirling batons that’s like the fata parade so people in Gaza are proud of

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that and Israel is trying one of the reasons Israel is terrorizing them so harshly is to first of all send them a

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message yeah you are proud of resisting you are proud to have a military well we’re going to make you feel the pain

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but also to send a message to everyone in the West Bank who’s not resisting and is still living under under the control

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of the Palestinian Authority which is here’s your choice you take take that and we’ll burn

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you a you know resist and we’ll burn you alive uh just take what you have and

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accept your life under occupation forever and Mahmud abas in some ways what he’s

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done is is impressive um he’s he’s outlasted all the other Palestinian

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leaders through cunning and guile and conniving against the interests of

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his own people uh and he’s just still alive somehow I mean whatever I don’t

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know what pills he’s taking but I want some of that I think this brings us to um uh

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Hamas itself I mean talking about uh representatives of people one of the

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arguments is that Hamas grew up um you

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know mid 2000 due to these betrayals uh of uh the

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Palestinian aspiration and they gave genuine um support to aspirations of the

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Palestinian nationalist cause how do you look and and but there are

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also reservations about Hamas how it operates internally um so on and so forth I was

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wondering what how do you look at Hamas as an institution and and maybe what do you think is the extent of support for

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Hamas uh within Gaza well I’ve been to you know

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Hamas uh celebrations or Hamas uh Hamas events in Gaza City we should

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say the Crowds Are massive there uh they have a large popular base and I’ve

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talked and I’ve spent time with people who are sort of part of the middle class intelligencia in Gaza who don’t support

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Hamas on a cultural or religious basis find them to be oppressive don’t support

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any faction but they support the alasan brigades which is the armed wing of

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Hamas and there’s a there’s a division between the leadership of Hamas and the

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alasan brigades you’ll see Hamas leaders out there shaking hands or um you know

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putting on a show with florid rhetoric Giant events and they’ll be surrounded

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by the fighters but you rarely see the leadership of the alasan brigades if

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ever it’s sort of a semi SEC organization like the IRA Muhammad da is the leader technically he’s the leader

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of the alasam brigades there’s only one photograph of him his Mo most of his

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family has been killed in Israeli assassinations um I wouldn’t say I was

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witness to one assassination attempt I was a neighborhood of way when Israel Dropped a 2,000lb Bomb on an apartment

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to kill him and he survived they killed his wife and kid um and it’s this I and

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he’s probably uh somewhat malformed or um very wounded from all the attacks

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that he suffered he’s on he’s probably in a tunnel so it’s this idea that he suffers

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with the people and faces the same circumstances that they do he’s not

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hanging out in Doha and Conference Halls like much of hamas’s exiled leadership

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is and so the people identify with him he’s sort of a folk hero and the the

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alasan brigades come from the people they are a popular fighting force that’s

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supplemented also by Palestinian Islamic Jihad but also by the pflp which is traditionally the left of

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Palestinian Society in Gaza it’s a little different um they right now I mean

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they’re militarily being supported by Iran there’s no Soviet Union to support them but you know it’s not just Hamas

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who’s taking the fight to Israel at this point so the point is they have the respect they have the respect of society

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which like any other Society under occupation wants to fight for their

30:19

Liberation Hamas also has uh you know its zakat committees its social Aid

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committees which have won a lot of Goodwill they’ve brought people Aid they’ve been

30:30

more efficient than the Palestinian Authority as a municipal Authority uh

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they’ve been less corrupt over the years although as they rule they become more and more like uh you know a typical

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government and you know I I I walked around Gaza City with you know some Youth and you would see these guys with

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short beards and Suits on coming out of uh hotels and they all have the same

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look about them they look like Muslim Brotherhood operatives and you could see the contempt that the youth would have

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for them that these guys are becoming very increasingly insular they’re bringing in money from Qatar to build

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fancy mosques while the people were suffering so there was that but at this point since October 7th I mean

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everything’s been destroyed and hamas’s message that we suffer with the people is resonating

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that we come from the people um and I think they’ve been greatly underestimated by the West which thinks

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that they can be removed somehow or that Palestine can be liberated from Hamas uh

31:35

it’s it’s not only delusional it really speaks to the ignorance the complete ignorance of the National Security and

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foreign policy Elite in the west that they’re actually backing up a regime change campaign against Gaza which is

31:51

leading to this humanitarian crisis because they will not allow Hamas police or municipal authorities to operate in

31:57

the open to protect the aid shipments and to allow the aid to be distributed to the people they’re backing a campaign

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of the complete political extermination of everyone affiliated with Hamas which is leading to

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genocide um so Hamas has to be recognized as a legitimate governing

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Authority if there ever is going to be a Palestinian State whether you believe in

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a two-state solution or a one-state solution the West refuses to do it I think another aspect here also is Islam

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and religion um that after the 1967 war

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which was so humiliating and was particularly

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humiliating for Gamal ABD Del Nasser who failed to see that the attack was coming but

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also for Haz al-assad uh the two lions of Arab nationalism a lot of people just began

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turning to the mosque and to is islamism and then within

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Palestinian society as Israeli repression grew harsher during the occupation and then particularly during

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the first intifada uh which was led um by secular

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organizations which which also which also gave birth to Hamas a lot of uh

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people also turned to the mosque for protection uh to get through the psychological Terror that was being

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imposed on them day after day and I know women from the West Bank who said that they put on the hijab they covered their

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heads just because it made them feel safer as they were constantly being teargas and facing violence all the time

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um and so that has to be recognized as well there’s really nothing that can nothing that can replace Hamas in

33:44

Palestinian Society unless the West wants to continue supporting nihilistic

33:51

genocide and allow everyone to starve in a despotic hell hole in which case you

33:57

will start to see an ISIS likee group start to come to the

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four yeah talking about West’s uh blood Lust For genocide um I wanted

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to ask you about Iran um I mean it was striking when you were um kind of

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separating the popularity or popular response to Hamas in terms of how they

34:25

look at the leadership uh Exile leadership in Qatar and how they look at their popular leaders on ground I was

34:32

thinking about how sections of middle class Iranians would differentiate between how to look how they would look

34:38

at you know aspects of what is called as the morality police and how they would look at the K revolutionary forces for

34:44

instance um but my question to you is that Israel has been

34:51

constantly uh trying to provoke Iran uh into a larger regional conflict and um

34:58

I’m not sure about the attitude of the Americans because the report seems to be

35:04

quite uh seem to be quite all over the place there are reports that American Elites are reluctant about plunging into

35:11

another Iraq like situation because they know that Iran is much bigger they are more powerful and so on but there are

35:17

also reports that says that the American Elites stand firmly behind Israel and

35:22

their instigation uh what’s going on at that on that front with the Americans

35:28

yeah what’s the American attitude to Israeli provocation of a larger regional

35:34

conflict well you know I was looking at the death of Ibrahim RI the president

35:41

and in the in the light of the killing or assassination of kasum

35:46

solmani who was the head of the irgc second most powerful figure in

35:52

Iran and you know the circumstances are the same although I can’t be sure that in a assassination took place here the

35:59

circumstance was that you know Donald Trump refused to uh was was was as much of a kind of

36:10

stooge of Netanyahu as he was he wasn’t going to give Netanyahu what he wanted

36:16

which is for the US to engage directly in a regional war with Iran on behalf of Israel that’s netanyahu’s Ultimate Dream

36:22

it’s his his life’s work is to get the US to attack Iran on behalf of Israel

36:29

because he recognizes that there is no resistance without Iran to

36:34

Zionism and Israel’s entire uh you know expansionist ambition

36:42

can be realized without Iran so solmani was

36:49

killed through uh after a long campaign of Netanyahu lobbying and

36:55

manipulating uh mainly through Mike Pompeo former CIA director who became

37:01

Secretary of State until they could finally convince Trump to do it they killed him on his way to a peace

37:06

conference with uh a peace conference in Iraq with Saudi

37:12

Arabia which was also very threatening I think the whole idea of Ira of Iran and

37:18

the sa and the Saudis coming together maybe working together through bricks uh would be

37:24

deeply deeply damaging to the whole Western divide and conquer strategy they killed him

37:31

RI was killed following this exchange between Iran and

37:36

Israel in which Israel attacked Iran’s Consulate in Syria in Damascus an attack

37:42

on Sovereign Iranian territory uh Brazen something we’ve never seen before more

37:48

Brazen than the US attack on the Chinese Embassy in belgrad and they were trying to draw the

37:54

US in and what did the Biden Administration they directly told Israel we’re going to send the Patriot

38:00

batteries we’re going to get the jordanians to help take them take down the Iranian uh inevitable Counterattack

38:06

and they did then they told Israel take the W take the win but we’re not going to respond and attack Iran and then

38:14

suddenly on a helicopter containing not just RI but also the foreign minister

38:21

and top religious figures it goes down the other two helicopters land uh the

38:27

political conditions are the same so the question is we do have the

38:36

question is how does the ruling faction in the US which controls the White House respond to the constant Israeli push to

38:44

provoke the us into attacking Iran an attack which I think violates

38:50

contravenes US national interests and the US does have national interests

38:56

which diverge St strongly from Israel’s I think on

39:02

the generally US national interests diverge from Israel’s at this point in

39:07

history um and the Biden Administration and the Trump Administration are slightly different there I think while

39:14

both would enable a genocide and be happy to uh cast the Palestinians into

39:19

the dust bin of history or the gas chamber of History whatever it is with this uh full this live stream Holocaust

39:27

were witnessing uh and they would maybe differ in their rhetoric about the

39:33

Palestinians the the Democratic faction wants to make a deal with a kind of

39:39

reformist authority in Iran that would be similar in their minds to the camp David deal with Egypt

39:47

and they would slowly domesticate Iran and bring them in but also allow Iran to

39:52

have an economy and to be sort of a mid-level power maybe some time at some

39:57

point in the future it could be kind of like turkey um but the Republicans particularly Trump are under the

40:05

influence of a much more vitriolic rabid Zionist force uh led by the Adelson

40:13

family Sheldon adelon who said that he wished that the US would drop a nuclear

40:19

weapon on Iran uh who’s dead but his wife runs his fortune it’s a cutout for Israeli intelligence Adon and Netanyahu

40:27

are the same thing and they have full control over Trump Incorporated so I think uh until no

40:35

until next January we’re going to see some resistance by

40:41

Washington towards getting directly involved with Iran I mean another thing

40:47

we can look at is the sort of flotilla that the Biden Administration sent USS

40:52

Eisenhower an aircraft carrier as well as uh Destroyers Cruiser class ships to

40:58

the Mediterranean after October 7th as a message to Hezbollah that was their

41:04

attempt to kind of reassure Israel and tell them hey we’re not gonna let Iran or attack you and we’re gonna make sure

41:11

Hezbollah doesn’t overrun you but it was also a way of saying that’s as far as we’re going to go take it or leave it

41:19

um so that’s my that’s my view on and I could I could be proven

41:25

wrong but I would expect as long as Biden’s in there many more provocations

41:31

to come between now and November particularly possibly in October surprise on behalf of trump uh Netanyahu

41:39

certainly wants Trump in there and I think we’ll see provocations

41:45

in the United States something I’m incredibly afraid of is a kind of

41:50

anti-Semitic false flag attack or just an ant an actual anti-semitic lone wolf

41:56

attack uh which is is inspired by all of the violence that Israel is committing and the images of it that are spreading

42:02

like wildfire across the internet and we have people like aland dich who’s constantly um you know

42:11

reiterating the need to attack Iran uh whether that’s a surgical attack on its

42:17

quote unquote nuclear installation or whether it’s restoration of the B

42:23

Dynasty uh Max I want to very quickly uh ask you because uh it became a thing um

42:30

when we had Ben Norton and discussed your uh discussed uh uh the The

42:36

Narrative of sexual violence a lot of our viewers said that this is not fair because it was the gry Zone who reported

42:42

it and you guys spoke about the intercept so you were one of the F first to push back against the S the The

42:50

Narrative of systemic um sexual violence that was reported by the New York Times

42:55

but you know that was all over over the December 28th piece so I just wanted to ask you uh that was a bold thing to do I

43:03

remember reading that I remember watching you coming to a bad faith and talking about it what made you so

43:09

confident that uh uh the whole Narrative of systemic sexual violence was just the

43:17

Trope and by the way I have about 10 minutes before I have another interview but uh yeah we we pushed back against

43:25

the entire Israeli Narrative of October 7th because I know when Israeli officials are speaking publicly and

43:31

their mouths are moving they’re lying and they’re lying in order to manipulate the American public into giving them

43:37

something that the American public normally wouldn’t in this case space to commit genocide so it was important to

43:43

push back and you know working with researchers and our team I was able to

43:50

clinically go through all of the testimonies and allegations and demonstr

43:57

how they were inconsistent simply not true didn’t match up with the facts on the ground

44:04

for example the facts about who was killed in which kibuts and how they were

44:09

killed and what their name what their what their ages were they never matched up um I also understood how propaganda

44:17

is conveyed through mainstream media I know how sloppy these journalists are uh

44:22

and how Craven they are and determined to get pulet or priz and other Awards

44:28

and so I immediately sensed that this sexual violence narrative was being

44:35

planted and seeded in Western media because the other narratives had failed

44:40

for example beheaded babies and you know fetuses being cut from pregnant women uh

44:47

also the Israelis had been exposed for the Hannibal directive uh in which they

44:53

killed many people on October 7th who were is Israeli citizens to prevent them

44:59

from being taken Hostage to deprive Hamas of political leverage and we you know I knew about the Hannibal directive

45:06

because I’d covered it before back in 2014 when it became a public thing I was

45:11

on the ground in Rafa whereas executed against an Israeli soldier who’d been cap who’d been captured so uh I guess I

45:19

just had this background and I think other people who are familiar with Israeli

45:24

propaganda uh Publications that do this full time like electronic andata they

45:29

had the same sense we did and they went full bore against this narrative and now

45:36

it’s really clear that we were right we’ve been Vindicated uh and you know the intercept

45:42

came in late in the game and started um definitely stealing a lot of credit for what we did although they later credited

45:49

us uh but they you know did some reporting as well that demonstrated that even people inside the New York Times

45:56

staffers inside the New York Times knew this was bogus and were Furious about the New York Times front page screams

46:02

without words piece we now have a screams before silence the Cheryl

46:08

Sandberg documentary which is one it’s a collection of one lie after another um

46:14

which is free on YouTube is a major propaganda vehicle for Israel and you

46:21

know electronic and defat did a great takedown of it but there are there are constant testimonies coming out out that

46:28

need to be taken down day after day and that’s part of our mission at the gry Zone um it’s what we did with the fake

46:35

weager genocide narrative it’s what we did with the Syrian white helmets exposing them as a western intelligence

46:41

tool for triggering regime change War uh and by extension the Duma deception in

46:46

April 2018 the the the staged chemical attack in Syria uh so uh the the the

46:53

humanitarian Aid deception in Venezuela where maduro’s troops were or Security

46:59

forces were accused of burning us Aid we exposed that as fake um so we sort of

47:05

have a mission to fill the void uh that journal that that that

47:11

media that that that journalists are trained to do which is to expose the

47:17

propaganda of the powerful and the militaristic uh and not be stenographers

47:24

and so you know it’s not really uh that uh I don’t think it it’s that

47:30

significant that we were one of the first on the scene to expose this given our history at the gry Zone this is what

47:37

leads the Wikipedia to write about the gry zone that it’s a friend’s uh yeah website News website that supports

47:44

authoritarian regime but I just wanted to let you go with this final question if you can just wrap up in five minutes

47:50

um uh China seems to be or us China Foreign Relations or us China relation

47:58

uh seems to be um a very big deal at the moment of history that we stand in even

48:04

people like John M shimer A lot of positive things that he says is predicated on this on this notion that

48:11

our bigger enemy is China um there’s a lot that the uh Chinese regime is trying

48:17

to do even with talks like the Arab China peace uh Chinese negotiation of the Arab talks um a lot is going on uh

48:25

uh lot of attempts are going on to destabilize the South China Sea so if you can quickly uh wrap up uh this uh uh

48:33

this podcast by sharing your thoughts about uh America China

48:38

relationship and just quickly on our Wikipedia page we were that page was set

48:44

up by our enemies many of whom seem to have some in affiliation with the

48:51

intelligence services and at the same time you were not allowed to site our work anywhere on

48:58

Wikipedia we are a deprecated source so they call we’re such a fringe publication that they obsess over us and

49:04

created a page to bch our reputation but we’re such a threat that you’re not

49:10

allowed to site us um this is not a people’s encyclopedia and one of the

49:15

things that we’re attacked for is clinically exposing the weager genocide

49:21

to be a gigantic hoax manufactured by operatives

49:27

sponsored by the state department to impose sanctions on China increase the conflict with China and drive The

49:34

Narrative of the new Cold War that’s from China’s West to China’s East you have Taiwan where the US supports the

49:42

most extreme political forces is violating Chinese sovereignty by moving weapons onto Taiwan sees Taiwan as the

49:50

next Ukraine and has financial and economic reasons for seeking conflict

49:56

with China over the Taiwan straight and in the South China Sea I mean the US economy is

50:03

is thriving at least a portion a part of it is thriving the average person doesn’t feel it because of the uh

50:11

military aid to Ukraine 63 billion of the 95 billion according to a Wall

50:17

Street Journal analysis that was just uh guaranteed to Ukraine and Israel is coming straight

50:23

back into the US economy so that’s part of the reason there’s conflict with China another part is ideological that

50:29

China is one of the last ostensibly communist or socialist countries standing that it’s the emerging economic

50:38

superpower that it’s competing with the US in AI um Apple stocks are hurting

50:44

because Huawei has now achieved 5G and is it its chips are at least as advanced

50:50

as apples so China does pose a a threat to us unipolar domination and there’s no

50:57

it’s no surprise that Victoria nland who was the author of the 2014 maidan cou in

51:04

Ukraine and had been managing this proxy war in Ukraine was pushed out as

51:09

assistant Secretary of State and replaced with Kurt Campbell who is the author of the pivot to Asia the US would

51:16

like to get this pivot going and it’s really a pivot to war but it can’t

51:21

because it remains bogged down with this war in Gaza and the Ukraine War drags

51:29

on um from China’s point of view uh China is in an advantageous

51:38

position on it from a purely at least from an intern perspective of international relations and China’s soft

51:44

power they’re in an advantageous position because the rules-based order which has been pushed by the Biden

51:52

Administration and this Tony blinkin state department has been full ful exposed through Gaza and China’s waiting

52:00

in the wings to actually emerge as a true Diplomat if there is to be any

52:07

resolution to these conflicts in the Middle East it could be China and Russia replacing the us as an actually honest

52:14

broker U but I think that’s years down the line Max uh thanks for your time and I’m

52:21

so glad we could do it finally me too hopefully we can do it again in the future without so many uh email

52:28

exchanges absolutely hi my name is aishman I along with jotis man have

52:35

started this platform the last two years we have tried to build content for the

52:40

left and Progressive forces we have interviewed economists historians

52:46

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