GAZA: hiltzaileen eta esperantzaren artean (7)

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(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFQYUwBYbmE)

H.E. Dr. Husam Zomlot testified at the UK House of Commons Foreign Affairs Committee, urging accountability for Israel’s crimes in Gaza. He called for a full arms embargo and emphasized that a ceasefire requires enforcement. Dr. Zomlot reaffirmed Palestinians’ rights to self-determination, return, and equal treatment under international law.

Transkripzioa:

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(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6n6Iv2WtZTI)

H.E. Dr Husam Zomlot called for holding Israel accountable for its crime in Gaza and elsewhere in an oral testimony at the Foreign Affairs Committee of the UK House of Commons.

You can’t expect the conflict to end with the current asymmetry between the occupied and the occupier, noted Dr Zomlot. “A ceasefire won’t happen without enforcing a ceasefire.”

He said that a full arms embargo was the only way the UK government could produce an impact on the situation, which will lead to the end of the war on Gaza. He added that the international community must stop treating Israel as a state above the law.

Dr Zomlot concluded his oral testimony by saying that three thing are non-negotiable: the right to self-determination, the right of return and being treated equally like other nations.

Transkripzioa:

0:00

our second panel is the head of the Palestine mission in London thank you very much for coming today sir we really

0:07

appreciate it um I suppose I ought to start by asking a a general question

0:14

really which is because this is an inquiry into what what could the British government do more to be of assistance

0:21

to ensure that there is peace in the Middle East and to have a lasting peace and I wondered if you could give us your

0:28

thoughts on what practical measures the UK could take to ensure a ceasefire in Gaza but also to build a lasting peace

0:36

thank you very much right honorable Emily Tom Bri and members of the Foreign Affairs Select Committee for uh this

0:43

very timely uh event and convening uh this conversation at such an acute

0:49

moment and in answering this question I would like to speak with the utmost urgency we the Palestinian people are

0:56

facing an Israeli attempt at total Erasure physical political and legal not just in

1:03

Gaza and not only for the last 14 months but for more than the entury of settler

1:09

colonialism this is happening in clear and gross violations of all standards and Norms of international law

1:17

international humanitarian law our shed humanity and simple common

1:23

decency and the absence of any effective intervention by the International Community over the past 14 months will

1:29

will leave future future Generations asking where were we during this

1:38

genocide what did we do the UK could be instrumental in bringing

1:44

this mass murder mass destruction to an end Britain has a unique historical role

1:51

in and responsibility for Palestine it remains an important and

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influential actor on the international scene it is one of the founders of the

2:05

global rules-based order it has deep and Lasting connections to large parts of the world

2:12

including our asion and it is a uniquely placed Western power closing enough right in

2:20

the middle with relations to the US very special relations of the US and the

2:26

EU with the EU distracted and the US unpredictable as we speak the UK is one

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of the few nations in the world in a position to step forward to fill a

2:40

vacuum of Global Leadership at a historic moment of Epic danger all over

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the world so honorable members the immediate priority in Palestine remains securing a

2:54

lasting ceas F that’s number one number two number three priority for us now an

3:02

immediate permanent ceasefire in line with the UN Security Council resolution

3:08

2735 including an exchange of hostages a full withdrawal of the Israeli Army and

3:13

a multi-year reconstruction plan for Gaza this must be overseen by the state

3:21

of Palestine and our legitimate National institutions there is no other alternative the unity of Gaza and the

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West Bank including e e Jerusalem the unity of our territory and people is represented by one legitimate address

3:35

that is the Palestinian government we must immediately

3:41

ensure the unfettered access of humanitarian Aid to 2.3 million people

3:46

who are suffering an imposed famine and all of you are seeing getting the images

3:51

from the north of Gaza 37 children have died so far of nut

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malnutrition people have been crushed to death as they were trying to get a loaf of

4:06

bread and finally these images are making it to mainstream media like the CNN and and the bbcs so images are

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disheartening the highest this last October was the the highest number of

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Israel preventing International aid from arriving even in comparison to last

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year uh and not only they imposed famine but the wholesale destruction of human and

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material infrastructure from housing and health care to sewi networks and agricultural land but a ceasefire will

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not be lasting my friends a ceasefire will not be lasting without the clear

4:44

political understanding and accompanying investment that the issue of Palestine

4:50

needs to be resolved now once and for all we have got to

4:56

focus on the root cause Israel has been clear in what and action that it has no intention of agreeing Asis far as of

5:03

this morning and I was with our colleagues in Cairo and and other places

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still foiling several opportunities since November 2023 Israel has been clear over several

5:16

decades of illegal settlement expansion that it has also no intention of reaching a political outcome other than

5:23

continued territorial expansion and indefinite military occupation we have

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got right honorable Emily focus on the end game here and the end game so far is

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very clear for Israel on the one hand and for us on the other hand or uh as we

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see now in Gaza it has turned fully uh into a genocidal aggression and

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therefore just to touch really on how do we begin to

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heal this given what we know already particularly in light of the

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international court of justice ice opinion that Israel’s occupation is unlawful and must end that all the

6:05

settlements are illegal and must be dismantled and that all third party states must cease to provide any legal

6:12

political or material material support to Israel’s occupation therefore in

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light of this there are four obvious ways to pressure Israel and to change the political status quo and here I also

6:24

mean the UK number one a comprehensive arms embargo number number two sanctions

6:30

number three accountability and number four an immediate former recognition of the

6:36

State of Palestine may I ask you to pause that because it’s a very comprehensive answer and we have some

6:42

other questions specifically for you and we don’t need we don’t want to to repeat

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that but there may well be many things that you’ve said in your statement that we would like to ask you further

6:53

questions on so given the time constraints that we have if if you if you wouldn’t mind um i’ uh I’d like um

7:00

I’d like John to ask um some further questions which I think you’d like to thank youw to uh Dr s can I begin do you

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unequivocally condemn the attacks carried out by Hamas on October the 7th

7:15

we have been very very clear from day one uh that uh we are not only committed

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to international law by words but by deeds and that’s why the state of

7:27

Palestine has sought the full force of international law of course we reject

7:32

wholeheartedly fully and in absolute terms the targeting of civilians that’s clear and we want International

7:39

institutions to make sure that all war criminals are held accountable and that’s why it was the state of Palestine

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that actually ratified the Rome statute and invited the IC to investigate not

7:51

certain war crimes all war crimes all violations of human rights all violations of the basic provisions of

7:58

international law and as you know sir since then it has been Israel that is blocking us from actually applying the

8:05

full uh force of the law you’ll be aware that there are reports of Palestinian

8:13

diplomats celebrating what happened on the 7th of October and that actually is

8:18

creating part of a problem that Israel will not have confidence in Palestinian

8:23

palestine’s commitment to a two-stage solution unless action is taken to Der

8:29

radicalize the Palestinian population I haven’t seen any Palestinian Diplomat celebrating anything Palestinian

8:35

diplomats are busy trying to expose the ugly reality that we have been living in

8:40

not only since the 7th of October and I’ve just said in my remarks this is a war of extermination against the

8:46

Palestinian people but even before on the 6th of October right honorable

8:51

friend it was already reported by International institutions that that was the deadliest year as far as Palestinian

8:57

children not in Gaza but in the West Bank at the hands of the Israeli military forces uh so the diplomats are

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are really busy trying to provide protection uh for our people and I’d

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like to remind you also that on the 7th of October of course we everybody was in a State of shock but we were not even

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given a a slice of time as you know the shortest period of time just to

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comprehend all what we got was Netanyahu Herzog and all Israeli leaders is coming

9:29

out and say we are going to be after the Palestinian people those are Political Animals we will kill all of you and then

9:36

Netanyahu quoting the amalik that they will kill every child Every Woman every animal of course we

9:43

went on the defense and of course we wanted to make sure that the 7th of October will not be used as a pretext to

9:49

slaughter our people and that is exactly what happened so but you do you accept

9:54

that as all of our Witnesses so far have agreed that two State solution is the

10:00

only way of resolving this and that will require the Palestinian population to live in peace side by side with the

10:07

state of Israel that question needs to be asked to Netanyahu not to me well we

10:13

we will I’m sure ask it to uh representatives of Israel but can I ask you as a representative of the

10:19

Palestinian Authority yes at least since 1988 the Palestinian Liberation Organization which is the umbrella

10:26

organization that represents all Palestinians the PLO which is the legitimate entity that represents all

10:33

and that’s why the UK recognizes the PLO the US does and the UN and the rest of the world uh uh in 1988 the PLO declared

10:40

the state of Palestine on the 1967 borders in line with International consensus and international resolutions

10:46

few years later the PLO recognized Israel fully as a state and since then

10:52

Israel has been in my opinion and in the uh given the events that has unfolded

10:57

since then blocking any possibility of a state Israel never recognized the state of Palestine that’s why it gets me

11:04

heated when I hear this question because it’s us who has been in working tirelessly to Implement International

11:10

consensus towards a two-state solution it’s us who have recognized the state of Israel it’s Israel and Netanyahu for at

11:17

least 25 years since he was elected first Prime Minister in grinded in the leud charter there and in the uh uh uh

11:26

uh Coalition agreement the last Israeli government Coalition agreement that they will never allow for a state of

11:35

Palestine then thank you chair like carrying on that point is it not the

11:41

case that a two-state solution can only be uh imposed and pushed for from

11:48

outside powers and what would you you say that looks like it must it must

11:55

because number one either we have international order we don’t either we

12:01

have law or we don’t you cannot be half committed about legality and I think legality is very clear Israel’s

12:07

occupation has got to end it’s almost six decades now the rights of Palestinians toward self-determination

12:14

has to be implemented un at the beginning you said the United States was unpredictable yes we all expect

12:21

something to happen when President elect Trump comes to office yes what do

12:27

you expect from the US and what other powers Saudi Arabia uh the UK uh which

12:35

outside Powers should take a leading role in trying to deliver

12:42

peace I expect one agenda to be advancing which is the agenda of the rule of

12:48

law that’s the agenda there are so many Regional and international actors who have different agendas none of them have

12:55

the agenda of the rule of law of the post World War II rules based order to be respected to be strengthened

13:02

to take its responsibility to apply the law equally on all that’s what I expect the agenda to resolve it and look at at

13:08

all other conflicts you will only find when there is such a sustained International intervention they will

13:14

resolved you cannot leave the conflict to be resolved at the whim of this very huge asymmetric power relations between

13:21

the occupied and the occupier the colonized and the colonizer the besieged and the besieger so yes we need external

13:28

interventions however that’s why I said the UK is very very crucial at this point in time you cannot

13:33

do this half in a half committed way you cannot be half committed to

13:38

legality to the law look at all the the policy options that could have helped us

13:45

achieve a cisa because a cisa will not be achieved without enforcing the cisa and the same token the two- State

13:51

solution will not be implemented without enforcing the two- State solution how do you enforce the two the two State

13:57

solution how do you achieve cisa number one you need the arms embargo and look at the way take it as an example the UK

14:03

did it the UK government who was half committed we will stop some we will make

14:08

some exceptions and the way it was commun communicated in the political sense while the decision was sound

14:14

legally it was based on legal assessment the political communication of it preempted any any substantial sort of

14:21

Leverage the same thing applies on the issue of sanctions while we impose sanctions on the individual settlers I

14:27

mean the UK government and in some uh settler organizations still the ecosystem of the settlements

14:34

is not being really sanctioned and bought and the ecosystem includes the trade includes the companies that

14:40

including UK companies that profit from these illegalities including the government the Israeli government that

14:45

backs supports sponsors directly these illegal Colonial settlements So my

14:50

answer to you is the only agenda that could resolve this conflict once and for

14:56

all is an agenda that is multilateral International that has international law

15:01

at the center of their attention that really wants to apply the law equally and ends once and for all this culture

15:07

of impunity that there is one entity that is above the law and the rule to and the and the exception to every rule

15:14

there is why we haven’t got to a two-state solution mean everybody consensus everybody says it’s in the

15:19

interest of Palestine the interest of Israel the interest of the region the interest of the rest of the world why

15:24

aren’t we doing it it’s that half commitment it’s that look at the US letter that was sent to Israel a month

15:30

and a half ago the US the US letter was very clear by the Secretary of State and

15:35

the Secretary of Defense to Israel if you do not allow unfitted humanitarian Aid the US will impose an arms embargo

15:42

in one month the one the one month came the one month went and there was no

15:48

consequences there is the issue the issue is when it comes to Israel the West simply is unable to be fully

15:54

committed to the very rules to the very systems to the very institutions the West has helded establish thank you Dr Z

16:02

I have um at least four people who want to ask you questions and I’m a little concerned that they we may end up with

16:08

another one of our terribly disruptive votes possibly more than one vote so I’m going to need to ask people just to ask

16:14

one question I know that there are many more questions people want to ask but if we I’m afraid I’m going to have to

16:20

insist of one question each thank you thank you Ambassador for your

16:26

representations youve talked talked about a lasting ceasefire and you mentioned the kind of parameters within

16:33

it and the multi-year reconstruction plan the withdrawal of Israeli forces and the freeing of hostages I asked a

16:39

similar question to the previous panel so I’d love to to know your answer to this do you think it’s possible to reach

16:45

this long-term settlement of the conflict in stages starting with the ceasefire or do you think there should

16:51

be a simultaneous effort with the ceasefire and future solution negotiations been conducted in parallel

17:00

you know the the the Palestine is not the only conflict in the world there have been many other conflicts and we

17:07

don’t need to reinvent the wheel here it’s clear number one you never

17:12

negotiate the principles you only negotiate the modalities of implementing the principles so the first and the

17:19

foremost step that we need right now is that the the world established these principles in legal stones and it has

17:26

been happening the icj opinion was clear the ICC ruling is clear the UN General

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Assembly resolutions are clear the UN Security Council resolution Vis C far is stages three stages is

17:39

clear the problem is in implementation it’s in enforcement and here comes the

17:45

role of the US the role of the UK the role of key players that are the pin holders of international the

17:51

International System so just not yes it could be done once we establish such a

17:57

clear path to everybody and once we say it by Deeds not by words that we recognize the two states so the UK must

18:05

recognize the state of Palestine now now before it’s too late if it’s not already too late let’s not waste more time and

18:13

then the then Palestine is admitted immediately as a full member in the UN you know what would be the difference

18:19

we’re done with the principles it’s in Stones there is no longer Israel and the Palestinians it’s Israel and Palestine

18:26

and then what we are discussing is minor details with the support of the

18:32

International Community that is the shift we need to make otherwise if it’s just a function of disputed areas and

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group of people called Palestinians you saw what Israel has up its sleeves up until this morning and not only Visa

18:48

Palestine by by the way Visa the region good thank you very um thank you

18:54

chair Ambassador last week in an Evidence session with the uh B the former Middle East Minister um we pushed

19:03

him on Palestinian recognition and why the UK hadn’t recognize Palestine when three quarters of the general assembly

19:09

has um his point was that there was a right time to do that that would create some kind of impetus to a peace process

19:17

I’m wondering if you support that View support what I’m sorry the first part he suggested that there was a a right time

19:23

to recognize Palestine that in some way supported the the the peace process and

19:29

I’m wondering if you agree that there is a right time uh and if that’s now or in the future thank you for the question I

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think the the the right time is now absolutely now and we are already late and the question is not why should the

19:42

UK recognize the state of palestin the question is why the UK did not recognize the state of of Palestine until now

19:48

that’s the only question and the UK has missed so many opportunities so many historic opportunities it it missed an

19:55

opportunity in in 2012 when we went to the UN eneral assembly for a un status

20:00

for the state of Palestine the majority of the world voted the UK abstained it missed an opportunity in 2014 when this

20:06

house voted overwhelmingly for the recognition of the State of Palestine it missed an opportunity in

20:12

2017 100 Years of the Belford declaration and that was a moment when the UK could come and say here it is it

20:19

is we take responsibility and we are about to correct that historic Injustice

20:25

that has befallen the Palestinian people instead the government then Double Down double down on the wounds of the

20:31

Palestinian people and you know the direct role Britain at the time played that Colonial arrogant moment promising

20:37

our land without consulting us and turning us from the native population uh

20:43

uh uh the Cradle of civilizations the birthplace of Christianity into non-jewish minorities that only have

20:48

civil and religious rights by the way up until now that’s the thinking in Israel

20:54

so of course Britain needs to do that a because recognition is a right not again gift and guess who said that word by

21:00

word the current prime minister sirama it’s a right not a gift not a favor what

21:05

are you waiting for then number two it is absolutely the right thing to do to really say that we mean a two-state

21:12

solution not only by you know words but by action and number three it will send

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the right messages to Israel that you know what this is it we mean it we are serious all of your expansion be beyond

21:25

the 67 will not be recognized it will weaken the forces that will kill the the

21:30

possibility of a two-state solution and it will Empower those who want to see a different future uh uh uh uh uh so it’s

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the most practical and I’m not going to dwell on into it and I believe every day

21:44

the UK Waits is another day in the coffin of a hope a real hope for a

21:50

peaceful resolution not only for Palestine but for the entire region and

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I think today it’s very clear that the serious problem is the relationship between the West including

22:02

the UK and Israel that relationship needs to be unpacked that relationship needs to be unpacked because with all

22:11

that support unconditional support and the and the lack of real Pol political

22:16

will to enforce a solution I think Israel is going to drive itself and maybe the rest of us into a cliff

22:24

recognition would be at least a very serious uh uh uh uh safety valve that no

22:31

way we are not going off a cliff we will have to take a turn towards a shared future I change the subject slightly and

22:39

um go to Matt thank you chair um thank you Ambassador what more can the UK do

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to encourage those holding British link hostages currently in Gaza to be

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released push for the full and immediate implementation of the UN Security Council resolution 2735 that the UK

23:01

helped draft sponsored and voted for that’s the key thing because that resolution has uh very clear uh uh

23:08

stages where it begins by the the release of uh and the exchange of hostages that it it outlines the stages

23:15

of withdrawal it outlines the roles of uh uh National and Regional uh actors

23:20

and it has the consensus of the world we have seen in November that uh hostages

23:25

could be released via diplomacy and given the situ ation now and given what happened in Gaza for the last 14 months

23:33

I think the the the the safest best way to do so is to implement the UN Security

23:39

Council resolution and to see hostages back to their families and why are those British linked hostages not being why is

23:46

the Red Cross not being able to go and see them the Red Cross should go and see

23:52

them and should be able to see them and why why are they not I don’t I don’t know why they’re not perhaps

23:59

uh you know perhaps not only the Red Cross you know Gaza has been an arena of

24:04

mass murder and destruction this is the first time in in history that such a situation is not is not being uh uh uh

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uh covered by International media even journalists are not allowed there even journalists and that’s why you had

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Palestinian journalists who have to cover uh uh the the atrocities

24:23

themselves and 134 of them got killed so not only why Red Cross is not there why

24:30

why the Yan has been bombed ask them would you take the opportunity to call I’m going to need to I’m we’ve still got

24:36

two more questions and we’re going to run out of time I’m so sorry this ought to be your last question okay well then

24:41

would you take the opportunity to call for Hamas to allow the Red Cross in to see those hostages absolutely and also

24:48

to Israel to allow the Red Cross to access Israeli prisons that have turned into mass murder of Palestinian

24:56

prisoners and rap that has been very documented and I have never seen a parliament except except Israeli kesi

25:03

debating if raping Palestinian hostages is legitimate or not so we want to see the Red Cross in Gaza we want to see the

25:10

Red Cross in Israeli presence and we want to see the IC implementing their arrest warrant in Israel and everywhere

25:19

else thank you chair thank you welcome Ambassador um want to start by offering condolences because I know the you know

25:25

the real situation on the ground people lose lives and you know as I understand it you’ve lost some of your family

25:31

members as well so my sincere condolences to you um just in relation to the settlements and on the West Bank

25:38

um bavier the minister has announced uh an expansion um over the coming year um

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and he has said that he intends to sub submit further money um from the parliament just on expansions what do

25:51

you think this does for the recognition um of a state given that potentially it

25:57

may not longer be viable thank you very much right honorable and uh bing does not just mean

26:04

expansion I mean he means annexation and that’s what they have been doing and working toward USS and you may have

26:09

heard the other fanatical minister in the Israeli government that is smotrich

26:15

who announced or a few weeks ago that Israel will Annex the West Bank by the year 2025 that’s a few weeks ago and of

26:22

course that’s the agenda that’s exactly the agenda and if you look the agenda is

26:27

that of very classic case of Satler colonialism

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very classic case of ethnic cleansing and guess who said that this is ethnic

26:38

cleansing the the former Minister of Defense Israeli Minister of Defense Bogi

26:43

ayon only couple of weeks ago that what Israel is doing now in the north of Gaza is a classic case of ethnic cleansing

26:50

coupled with the system that you may have documented here in this Committee

26:55

of military occupation colonization besiegement and a very well documented by the human rights this is the only

27:01

future Israel is offer there is no and by the way to uh to limit this uh only

27:07

to Netanyahu and and the extreme right-wing members of his government is

27:12

not does not serve Justice to the situation the majority of the Israeli political class now do not have a

27:19

Palestinian State as part of the future it’s as simple as absolute as that and

27:25

therefore the question for us is how do we challenge this reality how do we challenge this reality and the first and

27:32

the foremost beginning of answering that reality is how do we change this mindset

27:38

because people are not evil this is not just about Israelis being evil it’s about the mindset being evil the mind

27:44

frame is being evil and convinced because of many events happening around them convinced that the only way forward

27:51

is by this sheer revenge and reactions and massm and mass destruction and no future and no Horizon and no peace and

27:58

no partners and they don’t want to talk to anybody they just want to use the US provided weapons on mass numbers of

28:05

civilians and I believe this is a moment when we need to tab on that shoulder and change that mindset and and uh you

28:12

cannot leave it to us the Palestinians alone to do it you cannot Ambassador what can we do in terms of going further

28:18

so what what actions can we take as a government to prevent settlements expanding and the violent settlers as

28:24

well so the increas in violence of settlers in the West Bank what action do you think this government should be

28:30

taking exactly what is written in international law exactly why we have established the International System

28:35

states have responsibilities and if they do not adhere by these responsibilities then sanctions are merited sanctions are

28:43

called for and must be implemented look at at how we ended South Africa part time we are not

28:51

going to reinvent the wheel whenever it comes to Israel we have to create all the exceptions of the world Israel is no

28:57

exception it has violated every provision of international law all the way to the genocide in Gaza it has

29:03

violated the provision of international law even though the UN established Israel yet Israel has been in od with

29:10

the very provisions of the United Nations Israel believes that the it has a you know the the the UN Charter there

29:16

is a un Charter for Israel and there are a un Charter for the rest of the world so what we need to do I go back always

29:22

uh uh uh honorable friend to the very premise of laww because this this isn’t

29:28

just about Israel this isn’t just about Palestine this is about all of us look what is happening in the region now look

29:34

what is happening elsewhere either we are serious about the equal application of law or not so sanctions is important

29:41

arms embargo is important and it’s not just an ask it’s an obligation by the UK it’s an obligation by all third States

29:49

once the icj in January already 11 months ago came out and said that the

29:54

crime of genocide brought by by South Africa against Israel is Clos ible that genocide is plausible the conversation

30:00

should have been o over and and we are looking at a a former Attorney General here the conversation should be

30:07

over then the full force of the law must be applied so how do you apply it why do

30:13

you apply the law you apply the law also not only Justice for the victims but deterrence you want to deter that

30:19

mindset that mindset and the for sanctions arms embargo accountability accountability

30:27

people are are being so resilient of the idea that Israeli leaders should be held

30:32

accountable we hear Western we hear Western leaders politicians saying that

30:38

the ICC was not established for countries like the us or Britain or Israel seriously so the IC was

30:44

established for the brown and the black and the yellow not the white this is a joke this is the

30:51

beginning of the end of the International System we built that’s why people of the South

30:57

people of the the East people everywhere are losing faith in that International System that’s why that system is under

31:03

the biggest stress stress test test you can imagine so the the answer to your

31:08

question uh honorable friend is just apply the law put Israel under the law

31:14

not above it and deal with this West Israel relationship every morning Emily

31:20

I hear a western politician a British politician comes out and says Israel is

31:26

our closest Ally I don’t understand that what about Europe what about others there is no

31:32

daylight between USA and Israel how come Israel is a state the UK is a

31:38

state in some areas when you when you voice concerns criticisms against Israel

31:44

policy that includes a genocide you are seen to be anti-british and then they come out and they say we

31:50

have shared values with Israel British politicians can you please somebody tell me what are these shared values the

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shared values of what of Supremacy of supremacy of wholesale denial of

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people’s rights of ethnic cleansing of depopulating entire

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areas 14,000 children have been slained over the last 14 months

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14,000 do do I need to list for you how many Aid workers the highest in the

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history of conflicts the highest number of journalists the highest number of doctors did you hear Dr husam Abu saf in

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the north of Gaza only last week he had to bury his 15-year-old son that was killed in that hospital his hospital and

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himself was severely injured is being fought and fought hard because Israel is not only targeting lives it’s targeting

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livelihoods they want to see no hospital no school no water no nothing and yet you hear Western politicians every

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single morning about shared values come out and tell us come out of the closet and tell us what are these shared values

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that relationship needs to be visited looked at and then Israel needs to B

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exactly what it should be if Israel wants to be a member of the UN and you saw the Israeli ambassador to the

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shredding the UN chart literally shading the UN chatter if Israel wants to be part of the UN part of the community of

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Nations part of the region it cannot exist because it bombs the region it has bombed Lebanon it is bombing Syria it’s

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bombing everywhere it exists because the region accepts it and the region has offered Israel a formula of acceptance

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that formula is very clear resolve the Palestinian issue end your occupation and you will be we will normalize you

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and the relationship not only with 22 Arab countries what but with 75 countries do you know how old that model

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is Formula more than 25 years since 2002 23 years and it was completely

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disregarded because Israel wants to bypass the Palestinian issue Israel wants to be normalized without resolving

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the Palestinian issue why am I’m going so long with this because I think the problem is not just Israel because you

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know Israel is like any other state if you can have the cake and eat it too why not so Israel needs to receive

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consequences and not just Israel anybody anybody who violates the very provisions

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of the system we built needs to be brought to accountability so the answer is again and again in the rule of

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law I am I want to bring Blair in and if we’re able to get through Blair’s questions I’m going to let ummer ask

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another question because I know that she wanted to ask another one but we’re we’re still dependent on the bells of

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the of the of the votes thank you Ambassador can I also acknowledge and and offer my condolences for your fam’s

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uh suffering over the last last 14 uh uh months um in your mission statement H

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you call for a just anable solution to the issue of uh uh Palestinian uh

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refugees could you expand on what that what that means in practice and whether

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there is um uh room for negotiation and alternative uh Arrangements within

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within that desire for um The Return of refugees can I ask you bar why right

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honorable why do you think that statement is is problematic adjust resolution to the issue of refugees I I

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don’t think it’s problematic I’m just asking I’m asking you to outline what it means and practice it means what it

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means it means that two-thirds of the Palestinian people were ethnically cleansed from their homes and farms and livelihoods in 1948 those became the

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biggest Refugee is issue in the region and in the globe that’s why the UN had established international law Vis how to

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resolve the issues including resolution 194 and that’s why the UN also established honor to service these

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refugees until their issue is is resolved and that’s exactly why Netanyahu is targeting Ona because he

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he’s linking honor he’s linking horaa to the right of return and he’s wrong there horaa is just to provide services to the

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refugees but the right of return is enshrined in their property rights I mean there is the collective and there

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is the individual those people including my own father and grandfather they have Deeds to their own homes so we cannot

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brush this issue under the carpet and this is not an issue uh just up for negotiation and compromise I think we

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have to make a distinction between the principle and the and the and the sort of resolutions and the principle has got

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to be accepted Israel has to take its responsibility acknowledge its wrongdoing in 1948 the nakba peace will

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not be done or achieved or enjoyed if it’s not based on Justice and this is

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not a statement go everywhere without achieving justice peace is not sustainable we have tried it many times

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and how can you tell two3 of the Palestinian people oops we have negotiated your rights away but there

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are models there are international models look at the Balkans there are options that are given to these people

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and if I want to offer Israel a deal it has to be a final deal where everybody is satisfying and the future is going to

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be shared but this business of haggling I’m sorry haggling this business of haggling can you please forgo the right

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of return before we begin to speak can you just compromise this can you compromise further that let me say this

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bar allow me peace means the three following things for us and whatever happens these three rights have to be

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achieved number one our I just be very good i’ very much like to hear the three

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the three points but I think I then need to draw your evidence to to a close I’m so sorry I don’t mean to interrupt you I’m

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just saying you’re about to say that the the peace will will depend on three things and if you would be kind enough to tell us those but then I would I’d

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need to to bring your evidence to an end first the right to self-determination we are a nation

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people’s peoplehood on our land and we have functioning government we have got

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to have a state that can protect us and look what happened to us over the years and can represent us internationally and

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provide for us a political de democratic system number two the right of return and the right of refugees to be resolved

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and I believe there are already formulas that would be satisfactory and number three is being treated equally wherever

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we are however the business of let’s push the Palestinians a bit more is not going to do the minimum we we could

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accept the maximum we could offer is what have been on the offer for the last 35 years a state of Palestine on the

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1967 borders with East Jerusalem as its capital resolving the issue of refugees and treating Palestinians with dignity

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and equality everywhere and I believe these are not asks these are obligations upon any party that deals with us thank

38:35

you thank you very much indeed thank you for coming today and thank you for giving us your time thank you

oooooo