Hasierarako, ikus ondokoa:
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From Palestine to the World: Angela Davis & Dr. Gabor Maté https://youtu.be/a3-uWylemBM?si=J_o01SpMfppZgLYK
From Palestine to the World: Angela Davis & Dr. Gabor Maté
Bideoa: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3-uWylemBM
This conversation is released with the premiere of the documentary ‘Where Olive Trees Weep’, along with 21 days of talks on Palestine with leading historians, spiritual teachers, trauma therapists, poets, artists and more.
From Palestine to the World: On the Global Struggle for Liberation With Angela Davis & Dr. Gabor Maté
In this conversation, legendary activist and scholar Angela Davis and Dr. Gabor Maté, physician and author, explore the intersections between the Palestinian struggle for freedom and broader global movements for justice, equity, and human liberation.
Drawing parallels between the oppression faced by Palestinians and the systemic injustice confronting marginalized communities around the world, Angela and Gabor shed light on the common roots of violence, occupation, and dehumanization. They examine how trauma, both individual and collective, perpetuates cycles of conflict and how healing these wounds is integral to achieving genuine liberation.
‘Where Olive Trees Weep’ is a poignant, heartbreaking film about the struggles and resilience of Palestinian people under Israeli occupation. It explores themes of loss, trauma, and the quest for justice. We follow, among others, Palestinian journalist and therapist Ashira Darwish, grassroots activist Ahed Tamimi, and Israeli journalist Amira Hass. It features Dr. Gabor Maté as he offers trauma-healing work to Palestinian women tortured in Israeli prisons.
The program expands on the themes explored in the film and provides a larger historical and social context.
This conversation is released with the premiere of the documentary ‘Where Olive Trees Weep’, along with 21 days of talks on Palestine with leading historians, spiritual teachers, trauma therapists, poets, artists and more. From Palestine to the World: On the Global Struggle for Liberation With Angela Davis & Dr. Gabor Maté In this conversation, legendary activist and scholar Angela Davis and Dr. Gabor Maté, physician and author, explore the intersections between the Palestinian struggle for freedom and broader global movements for justice, equity, and human liberation. Drawing parallels between the oppression faced by Palestinians and the systemic injustice confronting marginalized communities around the world, Angela and Gabor shed light on the common roots of violence, occupation, and dehumanization. They examine how trauma, both individual and collective, perpetuates cycles of conflict and how healing these wounds is integral to achieving genuine liberation. ‘Where Olive Trees Weep’ is a poignant, heartbreaking film about the struggles and resilience of Palestinian people under Israeli occupation. It explores themes of loss, trauma, and the quest for justice. We follow, among others, Palestinian journalist and therapist Ashira Darwish, grassroots activist Ahed Tamimi, and Israeli journalist Amira Hass. It features Dr. Gabor Maté as he offers trauma-healing work to Palestinian women tortured in Israeli prisons. The program expands on the themes explored in the film and provides a larger historical and social context. Access to the program and the film is by donation. https://whereolivetreesweep.com/event
Transkripzioa:
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[Music]
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[Music] good morning good afternoon and good evening thank you thank you for being here my name is Mauricio Beno my name is
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Zia benatu and welcome to this conversation from Palestine to the World
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on the global struggle for Liberation with Angela Davis and Gabor
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mate um this convers is part of series on talks we are organizing uh on
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Palestine that will be released along with our new film called where olive
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trees weep which we film with Dr Gabor mate in
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2022 may2 in the occupied West Bank where we follow him um he was offering
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trauma healing work for Palestinian women who have been in prison and some
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of them tortured in Israeli prison and I want to read a brief bio which I know it’s completely unnecessary but
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never know in life Angela Davis is an international renowned activist scholar
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and writer who has dedicated their life to combat oppression in the US and abroad with a commitment to prisoners
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right and a powerful critique of racism in the criminal justice system Gabor
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mate renowned Canadian physician and author his work explore addiction childhood trauma and human development
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velopment his last book the meat of normal is a powerful critique of the impact of modernity and capitalism on
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our well-being just have to add Angela as a teenager in Italy Angela
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Davis has been my hero her and chear were they were giving me the strength to
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combat and to be a rebellious young teenager in it to me such an honor to be here so I bow to to this moment and
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thank you thank you thank you Gabor and Angela you have both been um advocating
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for Palestinian rights for for decades does this moment feel
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any unique or different um than any other times before
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and just gab I remember when we were in the West Bank uh you said I don’t hope
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to see any change in my lifetime and I wonder there was two years ago I wonder
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if that might have changed for you um maybe we start
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yeah when I said that I meant that I don’t expect to see any dismantling of designist apparatus I
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don’t see any easing in the occupation I see nothing more than further um
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imposition um Angel and I’ve been in know ways
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engaged with the struggle for a long long time and over that period of time
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we’ve seen the occupation get more Stark more oppressive more brutal uh less even
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um willing to hide its depredations from the public um the change that I have seen
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since October the 7th lo and behold the New York Times in
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the last two days had some pretty decent articles talking about what the occation actually looks like
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and the crimes of the occupation and the experience of the Palestinians I didn’t expect to see that and I didn’t expect
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to see the massive um uprisings uh in favor of Palestinian rights in favor of
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the truth that we winess witnessing October 7th Angela said a long time ago
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that the Palestinian issue is a moral lmus test for all of uh Humanity um I
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didn’t expect to see that litmos test become so clear to so many people so
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that’s the change that I’ve seen
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Angela you have anything to add to that oh yes
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um you know this is a on the one hand a very very difficult moment uh uh because
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we’ve seen uh an escalation of violence and
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and and torture uh intensification of of
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Zionism uh and so many Palestinian people are suffering but at the same time uh I know
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I have never experienced uh such a moment of hope uh for the cause of
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Palestinian freedom and I think it’s important to to
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recognize that um when we are involved in these struggles uh for Liberation uh
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around the world often times there is no Clear
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Vision of what the outcome will be there are no um
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guarantees but at the same time uh we we we have
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evidence that our activism does make a difference the work we do does make a
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difference difference and even though we may not know when we will see the evidence of that difference uh I I think
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that is what we have to keep um at the center of our vision like Gabor I never
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really expected to experience of something like this Global
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surge in um support uh around uh the the the cause
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of Palestinian Freedom uh I but on the other hand I
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knew and I have known that if we continue the struggle that one day um
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the the fruits of our struggle will become manifest U and I think that you
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know those of us like Gabor and and myself who’ve been involved in this this
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this movement for decades and decades we’re really privileged to be able to
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see uh some of the consequ quences uh uh of of the work that so many people have
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done over so many decades uh so I think that you know those who um are often um
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very sad that they don’t see immediate results uh uh can learn U from this
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experience not only with respect to the cause of Palestinian Liberation but the
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cause of global Freedom uh people all the world in in the Sudan in heti and
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and and in other uh places that where people continue to
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suffer angel I have a question for you um when I looked at my Instagram website
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there’s you know announcing this conversation with me you and I there was
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the usual enthusiastic hellos there was the acknowledgements than there the usual um
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impersonal um insults to either or both you and I that’s that’s
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just part for the course but one comment that I do did see a number of times is
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all this talking and nothing’s going to change and
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um it’s true I have to admit this conversation is not likely to save the
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life of or the living the little finger of one Palestinian baby or for that matter um and I have to say the
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tragedies on both sides I mean I looked at some list of Israeli soldiers killed in the last week or two they listed four
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four Israeli soldiers dead last week so and so Sergeant so and so 19 Sergeant so
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and so 19 Sergeant so and so 19 and force Sergeant so and so 19 imagine a
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society that when 19y olds are sergeants and they’re dead you know and
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so not that I equating the suffering or the responsibility on the both sides
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that’s the last thing that I do what I’m addressing is for all this talking that we do it’s true we’re not going to save
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a single life so I’m not asking this cynically and I suppose it’s a rhetorical question because I’m My Own
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answer but what is your answer to this question of we can do all this talking and advocating and activism it’s not
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going to save a single life well uh Gabor I think that of one
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um simply considers one instance uh uh then yeah of course uh one conversation
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will never make a difference one individual may never make a difference uh um and of course we who live in the
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west are accustomed to think um on those with those terms uh uh we see the
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individual as the unit of society we focus myopically on on on on single
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experience is but if one takes all of them together if one you know multiplies
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this uh this conversation by um a thousand or a
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million if one uh multiplies the the the protests that are themselves multiplying
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all over the world uh one can begin to see a difference um and I think that um
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what is um perhaps so important uh during this period especially is to
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imagine ourselves not as single individuals imagine our acts not as
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isolated acts uh but uh connected to uh vast numbers of people and vast numbers
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of protests all over the world that is what is capable of bringing about
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change can tell you why in your life um you’ve considered um Palestine such a
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moral as as I have by the way too uh such a moral litness test for the
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hor and in one of your books you talk about an amazing incident where um you were when you were in jail
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yourself in 1970 I think it was um and then you were tried on quy terrorism
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charges and you were eventually quitted but you received many
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um many um messages support and solidarity from people over the world
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including from Palestine yeah including from Palestinian prisoners and then when
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you went is did Palestine yourself you actually met some of these people who had who were prisoners at the
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time when you were a prisoner and and they had supported you it was a serendipitous meeting well apart from
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your personal experience why is Palestine such a Lo Stone such a l mostest for the
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whole world I think it is I’d love to have your words explaining why um well first of all uh let me say
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that um I have quoted my friend my um my
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my close friend and comrade who’s no longer with us the poet the black
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feminist poet June Jordan uh who said many many years ago
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that Palestine was a moral litmus test so I just want I I I I want to uh make
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sure that people uh recognize uh June Jordan as someone who was a Pioneer uh
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you know calling upon uh people all over the country uh all over the world and
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especially calling upon people involved in movements for black black liberation
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uh to stand up uh uh for Palestinian Freedom uh I truly believe that
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Palestine is a moral litmus test that um that one’s position on Palestine is
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indicative of of of one’s um sense of
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what Global Liberation is all about so that when we support Palestine we’re not
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saying that we only support Palestine uh uh we’re saying that we support
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struggles for freedom and Liberation all over the world and be precisely because
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of the tenacity of the Palestinian people uh precisely because they have
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refused to give up uh uh since 1948 since 1967 the uh I when when I visited
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um Palestine in 2011 I talked to a a man who was a
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storekeeper uh just um you know a conversation in the in the in the course
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of purchasing something at his store and he said to me he said as long as there
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is a single Olive Tree left in Palestine we will fight for the
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liberation of our people and that has stayed with me uh uh and I think that is
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the the the the the reason why we point to Palestine um as indicative of struggles
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for Liberation all over the world uh black people have been very much
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inspired by the struggle in Palestine um uh people in other parts of the world
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have been inspired by that and we know that if we manage to defeat
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Zionism we will be able to defeat racism everywhere we will be able to defeat um
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we will be we will have a sense of what it means to engage in struggles to
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overturn uh racial capitalism uh uh you know from
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Palestine uh to uh um Alabama let me
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say I think U there’s something unique about Zionism that you touch upon
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um um in one of your pieces uh you talk about that Israel is um not only the
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purveyor of a colonial settler project but also one of the active one that
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actively continues its violent expansion in the 21st centuries now the last seven
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months I have to say have been the heaviest darkest time of my adult life you know I mean and I this is subje for
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me and maybe it’s my jewishness and my own close relationship to the issue um I don’t know what it’s like for you you’ve
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lived through the same times that I’ve lived through the Vietnam War the Civil Rights struggle the South Africa
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aptide um and and you know struggle but there’s something about this and I’m not talking about numbers of deaths because
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I mean in Iraq half a million civilians were killed um not that long ago in in
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Vietnam millions of people died but there’s something about the quality of it that seems even more deeply
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disturbing and upsetting for me than what I’ve seen elsewhere and I if that’s
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true for you um but I think what it is for me is yes this is a colonial settler
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project it had to become one otherwise you couldn’t have succeeded but it’s almost like we’re
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seeing world history in speed it up fashion in a few months because this is
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went on for centuries here in North America here’s what this is when went on in in Africa for centuries and decades
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and so on but here it’s almost like we seaing up on our TV sets and our and Instagrams and our Tik toks and we’re
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seeing it in real life it’s almost like we’re looking at this horrendous version of our own past speeded up and magnified
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I don’t know if it’s if it strikes you that way but it’s like the whole Colonial history is like shown us now in
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this untrammeled horror and we can’t overt our
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eyes yeah thank you so much for um making that point and
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um you know I would add that uh the influence of of Zionism has been so
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powerful uh that it has blurred uh people’s Vision uh who who are otherwise
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uh take Progressive positions about the need for to support human rights in in
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in in in the world uh there you know this phenomenon of progressive except
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for Palestine yeah it’s something that we have been challenging uh for a very long
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time and it um continues um it continues today uh uh and as someone who went to a
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Jewish University I attended brandise University uh so that uh and I and I
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come from the segregated South as a matter of fact I grew up in the city that was uh
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the most segregated city in in the country U and
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our our first White allies were Jewish people yeah so you know I grew up with
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this uh sense of of the need to challenge anti-Semitism you know but at the same
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time when I found out what was happening in in in in
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Palestine uh early on um um attending a university that was founded in the very
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same year as the state of Israel uh I learned from my Jewish
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friends about the contradictions uh uh and and and so so I grew up with a sense
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of the need both to challenge anti-Semitism and to stand with
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Palestinian people struggling against the setler colonial violence uh
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inflicted by by Israel so so I would say that
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um that has been the the most difficult issue the
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assumption that if you are against
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anti-Semitism then you have to be opposed to the Palestinian struggle for
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Freedom if you are against anti-em ISM you have to stand with the state of
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Israel uh uh
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and my experience has been that Progressive Jewish people are the
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ones who have given leadership to this struggle precisely because they recognize the kinship between what is
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happening in pal in the occupation of Palestine and what happened historically
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in terms of of of the Holocaust uh um so I you know I I I I think that um the the
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the contradiction the apparent contradiction uh is something that we uh
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have to um uh recognize is is not a contradiction uh to be opposed to
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anti-Semitism to be opposed to racism to be opposed to settler colonialism and
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its impact on the Palestinian people is
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one struggle one Global struggle for human rights I think one aspect of that
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difficulty is that um Zionism isn’t just a standalone
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movement it’s very much uh embedded in interwoven with the much larger and much
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more powerful Imperial project so therefore as long as the Empire and its media
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acolytes um see Zionism as necessary to their purposes is very difficult for
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people here to even hear the other side and as I mentioned earlier today
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perhaps for two days in a row now the New York Times I had take my take take my hat off I’m also almost speechless
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has presented today and yesterday two articles that actually tell the truth about the occupation but that
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extraordinary unusual and usually and for decades the emphasis has been on the
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violence of the other side and it’s some point you actually right I’m just going to quote you if I may you say uh and you
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wrote this in your book uh freedom is a constant struggle published in 2016 so
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lest anybody think thinks that history began on October the 7th we’ve been
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talking about this for a long long long time and Angela wrote in 2016 is that um
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placing the question of violence at the Forefront almost inevitably serves to obscure the issues that are at the
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center of our struggles for justice and uh can you just talk about that how the
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the violent um I don’t know anybody
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that justify some of the events that happened on October 7th I don’t know anybody who does um but at the same time
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if we assume that that’s where it all began and the only issue is Palestinian violence what can we possibly understand
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so placing this issue of violence at the Forefront is is is a way of
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ignoring all the history and all the systemic issues that actually result in the eruptions of that violence can you
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talk about that uh yeah thank you um gavor this is um an issue that um has
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always clouded struggles for Liberation uh uh I can talk uh just briefly about
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the the Black Liberation movement in the US uh and uh there were of course those
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who advocated uh um the use of violence um mostly for self-defense uh uh and and
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and and we were often interrogated about um
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um uh why we didn’t take a position of absolute nonviolence
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uh uh and we pointed out that you know self-defense is about defending not only
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individuals but defending the right to be in struggle for Liberation uh uh but
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violence was always a central issue and of course that misconstrued the extent to which the
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state used violence against struggles for a better world uh and it
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uh prevented people from recognizing the extent to which the state was in
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possession of the Monopoly of violence uh and so you know Palestinian young
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Palestinian um uh uh people who use rocks uh uh to indicate their uh uh
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their refusal their refusal to Ascent to
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occupation U becomes the um the emblem of violence whereas the tanks and the
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bombs uh of the IDF uh are not considered uh violence in that respect
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uh so I I you know I I I think we have to talk about violence
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because violence does corrupt violence does uh you know I mean I would be happy
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if we didn’t see any more violence in the world but to assume that those who
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are fighting for a better world and attempt to defend themselves or attempt
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to express themselves uh uh uh through U
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modes of violence that are often times in significant in comparison to uh the
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vast uh violence of of of of militarism and Armed Forces uh uh that that that uh
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makes it impossible for us to really understand uh uh the right side of
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History I think we can give one example of that in the very contentious and very
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sad issue of hostages um people say release the hostages and yeah
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it’s you you broke for a second who abducted oob hostages not be there but
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we don’t talk about okay but so there’s it’s it’s very
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sad about the hostages and we all wish they were free what we don’t talk about is the hostages on the other side in
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2016 already Angel wrote that about the thousands of Palestinians in Israeli
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jails including uh something like you mentioned that 800,000 men this is by
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2016 we’re talking about eight years ago now
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800,000 Palestinian men had been through the Israeli jails 40% of Palestinian males 40% of Palestinian males have been
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jailed by Israel at one time another
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40% and the only G and we talk about hostages the
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orthopedic Department of alifa Hospital who was a orthopedic surgeon who saved
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lives he was arrested he was 53 a man in his in the height of his Vigor and
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health father of six children he was arrested while doing his Orthopedic work
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in Aliva hospital he was beaten and tortured to death in an Israeli prison
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didn’t even D to mention it and this time Palestinian thousands
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of them may year children are captured with a charge not if there was not that even
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there could be a legitimate charge against them and occupying power has no right to arrest anybody um for resisting them if a child
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writes a sign saying done with the occupation they can be jailed and they don’t talk about the
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torture in Israeli jails they don’t talk about the fact this is written in the Israeli press that some of the prisoners
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taken in Gaza had their hands and feet tight so tightly that the circulation was cut off and they had limbs had to be
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amputated and this has been divulged by Israeli Physicians you don’t see a mention of it
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in the western press absolutely and and and thank and so so
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that there’s no you know all I’m asking for and I think all you’re asking for is some equivalence of
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concern rather than this one-sided presentation of of one party is always
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the perpetrators of violence and the other as just defending
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themselves absolutely and and thank you so much uh Gabor for all of your work uh
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in um bringing uh this um uh lopsided
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assumption uh uh about um uh violence
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and incarceration to light uh uh and and and let me say that um you know I’ve had
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the opportunity on several occasions to meet um sah Frances uh who is the head
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of adamir uh and and um we have learned so much about the
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role of incarceration those of us who do work around prisons and let me say that
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uh uh that was that has been my first connection with Palestine political
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prisoners and struggles around uh issues uh of imprisonment uh and our effort to
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create an Abolitionist Movement uh in in in this country that has uh uh benefited
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so much from the experiences and from the theorizing of the role of
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incarceration uh in in in in in Palestine uh the role of administrative
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uh uh detention as you were pointing out the vast numbers of of of uh uh
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Palestinian uh men the the majority of whom have had some connection uh with
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the uh apparatus of of incar eration but we learned also that
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imprisonment is not an isolated phenomenon that it it it it is is not
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simply about placing people within institutions of jails and prisons
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that that um that the the society um
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that is um uh that has been created
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it by um the by Zionism by the
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occupation that it is a carceral society uh that uh I mean we learned many years
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ago that we can’t simply consider the issue as one of
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incarcerating individuals in a par inside of a particular institution that
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that carcerality gets expressed in the checkpoints it gets expressed uh in um
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in in in in the fact that um you know Gaza has long been represented as the
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largest open air uh prison in the world uh that Palestine has been represented
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as an open air prison uh so um uh I I I
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I think the all over the world we’ve we’ve we’ve benefited from the experience of of
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Palestinians with respect to the um various modes of of of carcerality uh
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and um let me you mention this in the beginning but but but I’ll emphasize uh
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uh the fact that when I was myself incarcerated back in the uh early
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1970s uh one of the most memorable moments of that period was a solidarity
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message that I received uh uh from Palestinian prison uh prisoners uh the
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message had been smuggled out by their attorney and it was brought in uh to my
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jail sale by my uh attorney and uh I um
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you know I’ve always considered myself an internationalist uh but moments like
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that uh uh emphasize and reemphasize how
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important it is for us to feel connected across oceans across geographical uh
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boundaries for us to uh recognize that um that in that that that we are one
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people we really are particularly considering the fact that that we live
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on a planet uh that is one of billions of other planets uh in in the universe
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and Beyond uh and the fact that it’s often so difficult as
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a consequence of systems like racial capitalism and and Zionism and
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colonialism uh to um uh experience the Affinity we should all have with each
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other uh is uh is is one of the saddest uh uh um experiences and the sad is
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consequences of of of
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capitalism Gabor we hear you speaking of unity and
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Oneness last night an Israeli friend sent me a YouTube link to a ceremony
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that was held in Israel I think a couple of days ago by a group called combatants for
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peace and these were mothers there was a mother who
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spoke who son went dancing on October the 7th ended up dying in a box bomb
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shelter a beautiful young man Palestinian mothers who’ lost their sons
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and these people had all come together to mourn together and to pledge to work
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for peace together and uh to pledge to respect and honor one another and these are
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Palestinians and Israelis coming together in this Unity of grief but also
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of commitment to peace and um it it it was mesmerizing and
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beautiful and heartrending but ultimately so full of Truth and and and and peaceful
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possibility um Zio I’ll find that link and I’ll put it into the chat line if you want to spread it uh yeah we did we
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just share and we know them yeah you know okay very good okay I just want to
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mention that positive note um Angela I want to come back to one more issue that
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you mentioned is Progressive about everything else with Palestine um there’s so many fellow Jews that I now
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that are decent really good-hearted people who do wonderful work in the
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world commit themselves to healing and to humanity
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um and who on this issue particularly if they’re in a
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certain generation they cannot [Music] see the forest for the trees they just
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cannot uh I know Wonderful Jew I have wonderful Jewish friends from who live
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through apartheid in South Africa who are totally clear about the Injustice of
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the system that they grew up under but who cannot see the parallels despite the
36:22
fact and you mentioned this yourself that Mandela was very clear
36:28
that as long as Palestine is not free South Africa can’t be free and so you
36:34
you talk about the sanctification of Mandela and what’s interesting is it’s a
36:40
very um selective scientification they scientifi some
36:47
aspect of his work but they don’t much mention how clear he was on issue of
36:53
Palestine and so can you just talk about this phenomena
36:59
you mentioned it of progressive and everything else and being able to see Injustice everywhere else or not on this
37:06
one I think I think it’s a trauma outcome I think it’s a people stuck in a kind of
37:12
traumatized view of the world but um I wonder how you’ve dealt with it in
37:18
your life well you know first of all I think it’s
37:25
really important to uh point out uh that um Progressive and radical Jewish people
37:34
have given leadership to the movements of this moment uh uh and and
37:41
historically my experience has has been that um that that Progressive Jews
37:51
including people who have the experience of the Holocaust and
37:57
background have been the ones who recognize uh how important it is to
38:04
express solidarity uh with Palestine I was on on the Russell Tribunal for
38:11
Palestine and of course that’s an example of a a formation that is that
38:17
came into being precisely because of the fact that Progressive um Jewish people
38:23
felt that something urgent had to be done so I I I I I I don’t think that we need to um
38:32
Ascent to the assumption that to be Jewish uh is uh uh to be uh uh in line
38:42
with the policies of the state of Israel uh and and and but on the other hand as
38:49
you pointed out uh precisely um because of the ideologies
38:55
of the the last um um decades uh uh so
39:02
many people assume that to be opposed to the state of
39:07
Israel is to engage in anti-semitic um uh
39:13
activities that is ideological that is what we have to challenge and I think
39:19
that uh when we see the consequences of the work that has been done over the
39:25
last decades uh now there have been occupations um uh two days ago there
39:33
were occupations that were still existing on um or I shouldn’t say I
39:39
shouldn’t use the word occupation because because of its connection uh you know with the occupation of Palestine
39:46
but but um um uh what is the word that they’ve encampments they’ve been and
39:51
their encampments uh in 180 un I ities in in this country uh uh
40:01
you know what has happened over the last months has been absolutely incredible
40:07
and it it it also lets us understand how we must go about challenging
40:14
Zionism the fact that you as you pointed out the New York Times has had a couple
40:21
of very extensive articles on the occupation which is UN precedented for
40:28
the New York Times Yes and these articles didn’t appear because the New York Times certainly um uh began to
40:36
rethink themselves in isolation uh what their coverage had been and and made a
40:43
decision to change it it’s the impact of all of the protests uh all over this
40:50
country uh but all over the world uh because protesters in the US were not
40:57
the first to stand up to stand in solidarity um with Palestine and I think
41:03
you mentioned uh Nelson Mandela uh uh South Africa has been in the Forefront
41:09
of the global solidarity uh movement uh for you know so many years I can
41:14
remember that I attended the UN conference Against Racism that took place in Durban uh in 20 in
41:23
2001 um and it was the South Africans who were arguing uh uh for an an awareness of the
41:33
aparte nature of the oppression of the Palestinian people uh uh so this
41:41
struggle has a very long history and for those who are accustomed to um uh
41:49
immediate results instant results uh uh uh it has not uh borne very many um
41:57
um fruit but at the same time those of us who see the protracted nature of
42:03
struggle and are willing uh to uh recognize that it is important to pass
42:09
on from one generation to the Next Generation uh uh the uh uh the the the
42:17
the importance of standing with Palestine uh that eventually it does uh
42:25
uh bear fruit we we do see the consequences of that uh very long and
42:32
prot protracted struggle that is why the New York Times articles appear you know
42:38
I said I want to give credit where credit is due it’s not the New York Times that independently decided to do
42:45
that they recognize that if they are going to be on the right side of History
42:50
U they have to respond to the demands of the millions and millions of people all
42:55
over the world who are saying uh uh we want to see uh freedom in Palestine now
43:04
we want Justice for Palestine right now you know you mentioned South
43:10
Africa’s advocacy um for justice in Palestine and I was watching the the
43:17
South African lawyer Advocate that the international court of justice speak
43:23
yesterday and this is a subjective point but when I heard her speak or when I
43:29
hear one of the Irish Representatives speak and the Irish are are uniquely interesting example in Europe because
43:36
they’ve suffered British colonialism imperialism for hundreds of years so when you go to Ireland there’s a lot of
43:42
support for Palestine because those people know on their own skins what it’s like to be colonized
43:48
but anyway when you listen to these Irish people speak or the South African they’re they’re not just
43:54
reciting dry facts or or or statistics
43:59
or um viewing history you can actually feel on the human level on a heart level
44:06
here’s a real person speaking with real emotions and the South African
44:12
lawyer fairly young woman was talking about the sitation of
44:17
children at some point gets very emotional and nearly into tears and then when you listen to the
44:22
Western spokesman and Israeli spokesman you hear these dry
44:28
voices devoid of emotion full of
44:33
superious um sense of superiority you people don’t understand we understand
44:39
I’m just saying that even if you didn’t understand the words that were being uttered on the human level there’s such
44:46
an exchange of there’s such an expression of reality
44:51
and heart-c centeredness on the one side and a refuge into the cold calcul mind
44:57
on the other you can’t by struck by it even if you don’t know the
45:02
facts absolutely and I think Gabor that um uh we’ve missed over the the the last
45:12
decades a sense of what it means to be emotionally connected uh uh to uh people
45:19
who are suffering in other places uh um because of the nature of the media the
45:26
role of of of of uh mass media we and and the way as you pointed out and in
45:33
which uh often times it’s about numbers it’s about facts uh U but um you know I
45:41
I had been thinking uh before October 7th that we haven’t in a very long time
45:48
experienced a movement where we felt that kind of emotional connection uh and
45:54
I remember the the the struggle of for uh this the struggle around Vietnam uh
46:01
when when when we were we were uh allowed to experience our Humanity our
46:08
expansive Humanity as involving people who were suffering from us militarism in
46:16
Vietnam and and I think that’s um that’s that’s that’s so
46:22
essential and and I I don’t want to under estimate all of the horrendous
46:29
suffering that has happened in Gaza and on the West Bank and elsewhere in
46:35
Palestine but I do want to point out that that vast numbers of people now
46:42
have that emotional connection and and and therefore have
46:48
experienced a much more expansive sense of their own
46:55
Humanity yes yes
47:00
um let me ask you about how you see the world like back in
47:06
the 70s when or the 60s when you and I were well same age only as I said only
47:12
three weeks apart in birth terms in that youth of mine I did think
47:21
naively that if we only work idealistically enough and hard enough of
47:28
this world is going to change for the better and um there was that same sense of U triumphant expectation
47:36
around the Civil Rights Movement as well and so on and for a while things seemed
47:42
to be just expanding and opening up and then to quote the Hollywood movie
47:49
The Empire struck back and uh we’ve
47:54
seen almost the opposite happening over the last couple of decades the
47:59
movements have lost some degree of momentum uh unions are much more
48:06
suppressed um the Press has become much more monolithic and people have become
48:12
more passive now we’re seeing then as George Floyd happens and
48:18
and Traver and Martin and there’s periodic expressions of solidarity and
48:24
resistance um again we’ve seen a surge of that over Gaza and maybe this will
48:30
catalyze something more long lasting but how do you see it going overall since
48:35
you’re enthusiastic and maybe sometimes not I don’t say naive but uh yeah you’re
48:43
enthusiastic youth are you are you able to maintain the same enthusiasm do you
48:48
see still partake of that same momentum
48:53
or do we acknowledge that there are setback and sometimes it recedes and
48:59
sometimes it moves forward what is your sense of this whole thing well
49:06
um you know those of us who have spent um um more than eight decades on on on
49:15
this this Earth uh of course the perspective is different uh from those
49:22
who have spent two decades yeah but I
49:29
um I I value that sense of urgency that comes uh uh from youth uh and that um
49:39
that assumption uh that that we have to
49:45
act now in order to save the planet we have to act now in order to guarantee uh
49:52
that uh more people are not sacrificed on the altar of uh uh racial
50:01
capitalism uh colonialism I um you know oftentimes
50:07
people ask me uh what would you say to your younger self uh you know what what
50:13
would you say to yourself the self that believed that was possible for revolution to happen uh in uh our
50:22
lifetime and and I often respond by saying I’m not so much interested in in
50:29
uh schooling my younger self I’m much more interested in what my younger self
50:35
would think about what I’m doing now uh so that so that um I try to maintain a
50:43
connection with uh with young people you know both as an educator uh and
50:49
especially as an activist uh I remember when I was young the older people I was
50:56
most most impressed with were those who were willing to have serious conversations with those of us who were
51:02
younger are those who uh believed in egalitarian uh relationships across
51:09
Generations uh and I try my best to do that now I don’t know whether I succeed
51:15
uh uh but I think we do need the the the the urgency that young people feel
51:23
without that uh our movements don’t have an an engine they don’t have uh uh the
51:29
capacity to uh push themselves forward and you know of course we believe that
51:37
Revolution was possible that it would happen uh in during that period uh and
51:44
um and of course it didn’t in the way we imagined it those of us who imagin the downfall of capitalism and racism and
51:51
you know all of that uh uh but in the process of fighting for those lofty
51:58
goals we brought about change and I hold on to that uh we would not be here today
52:06
with our um Notions of how important it is to Stand Up Against
52:13
Racism uh and the fact that racism is global that it’s connected to um uh
52:19
settler colonialism uh uh which as you point out Israel continues to try to
52:27
expand uh if we had not done that uh uh during that period we would not be where
52:33
we are now so we may not have we may not have achieved the revolution we thought
52:40
was on the horizon but we did um make the kinds of
52:46
changes that have allowed people to become much more aware of about the
52:54
interrelationships between racism and heteropatriarchy uh and homophobia uh
53:01
and and and and and and why it is um that traumas as your work has uh uh
53:08
pointed out trauma uh uh moves from one generation uh to the next uh and that
53:15
often times traumatized people may repeat uh May engage in the in in in in
53:23
the kind of of of of violence that was inflict did on them uh I mean I think
53:28
we’ve learned so much uh uh you know I often point out that at at the beginning
53:35
of my trajectory in this struggle um uh I was convinced that uh what we had to
53:42
do was free the black man because that is what we were told and now we know
53:47
that we can’t talk in those gender terms uh that is not only about the the
53:53
man and the woman but it’s it’s a challenge to the binary structure of gender uh and so I could talk about so
54:00
many insights so much uh Consciousness that has occurred as a consequence of
54:08
those struggles uh uh but uh you know often times uh it it takes um it takes
54:15
decades it takes hundreds of years uh of you know
54:20
we who are uh the beneficiaries of enslaved people’s uh
54:27
refusal to accept slavery and you know they stood up
54:33
against slavery they could not have imagined that we would be where we are now but we are only here by virtue of of
54:41
of of of their commitment uh to struggle for Freedom well thank you beautifully put
54:49
um to conclude this and I know you have to leave um two things spring into mind that I’ve
54:55
been quoting quite a bit recently one is uh from the bav Gita where it says that
55:02
you’re entitled to your work but not to the fruits of your labor you know so you
55:07
do it because you do it you don’t do it because you’re expecting a certain outcome number one number two there’s a
55:12
Jewish rabbi 100 years before Jesus who said that the task of healing the world
55:19
the task is not yours to finish but neither are you free not to take part in
55:24
it so I do think that those of was engaged at this work cannot be discouraged by temporary setbacks or
55:33
apparent lack of result as you point out we’re contributing to something and
55:38
those of you who are listening who may be overwhelmed by the forces ranged against the truth that as they
55:44
understand it don’t be you’re part of something much greater much more historical and much more essential and I
55:50
think that’s what Angela’s words just all pointed to
55:56
and also if I can um um make a statement uh
56:03
regarding uh the importance of being aware of the fact that those who came
56:10
before us cre uh the foundation for the work that we are doing uh you know often
56:18
times uh uh people um think that they are the firsts that that they are the
56:25
ones who are are uh doing the important work uh uh but we can do what we’re
56:32
attempting to do now only because of what was done by those who came before
56:38
us so I think it’s so important to develop a historical consciousness that
56:45
extends not only into the past but into the future uh and so uh yeah we won’t be
56:53
able to um winess what the full consequences might
56:59
possibly be of the work that we’re doing now but we do know that if we do nothing
57:05
um uh there will not be a future in which uh uh the the the the the the
57:13
borders of Freedom will expand and become inclusive uh uh for uh the
57:19
Palestinian people uh so I I I I also
57:24
like to think of um those of us who are U older as you and I are as representing
57:33
for those who were no longer here uh you know for those who gave their lives to
57:38
to to the struggle and made it possible for us to reach this point we are
57:45
witnessing for them as well
57:50
absolutely wow thank you thank you so much Angela
57:55
for we honor you and for for your work for the global Collective struggle for
58:02
Liberation your voice of many and thank you for keep reminding us that we are
58:07
not individual this is not an individual work and as much as we are fighting
58:13
against Zionism and colonialism and capitalism we have to also be um against
58:20
individualism because this is really what’s the it’s the essence of created a colonial project allowed allowed that
58:28
that mentality that thinking that was imposed on indiv on indigenous way of
58:33
being and um seeing the world as as a collective home as a one inter thank you
58:40
so much for for being here with us today for your time
58:46
and um Gabor has gracefully agreed to to stay a little longer to address the
58:53
questions and we have your mind G gracefully or not but I will stay on
59:02
you let me say that I’m I’m I’m sorry that I had another um uh event and so I
59:09
I do have to leave before the questions but this has been uh really inspiring
59:14
and thank you so much Gore for the work that you have done uh for for so long uh
59:21
and uh and and and thank you for doing this work that will uh reach ever larger
59:27
numbers of people who hopefully will also become a part of our movement for a
59:33
better future uh for the Palestinian people and for all people in the world
59:39
thank you thank
59:45
youel so there’s lots of questions maybe we’ll start with reading a few and then
59:51
bring a few people online sure so um
59:59
we didn’t speak there are a few questions about dehumanization how that dehumanization
1:00:05
paves the way to genocide and how much of that is um
1:00:12
rooted in intergenerational trauma anything you have to say on that
1:00:18
well
1:00:27
so any project that wants to empower one
1:00:34
people to displace or rule over or have more
1:00:40
rights than another has to either subtly but increasingly overtly
1:00:47
dehumanize that other people so it has to begin with I have
1:00:52
more right than you do if eventually it becomes you’re inferior to
1:00:59
me and this is an the whole idea of race for
1:01:04
example you we think that race is a given entity but race is actually a
1:01:10
construct there used to be no racism until about the Advent
1:01:17
of of capitalism where the expanding Colonial
1:01:22
capitalist countries of Europe decided they to take over parts of the world that have were
1:01:29
already populated and so on these people had to be made
1:01:37
inferior otherwise how would be have right to take over what they what they
1:01:43
possess so the whole idea of a black race or a white
1:01:48
race they’re no races in reality I mean you know a skin color or configuration
1:01:53
of nose or lips does not make you A different race there’s only one race the human
1:01:59
race so the whole idea of race itself emerged out of a political economic
1:02:05
imperative to colonize right now the slave owner has to believe
1:02:15
that they are superior to the slave they even have to
1:02:20
believe that the slave is happy to be a Slave so a lot of the southern slave
1:02:28
owners um really lived in this belief that their their were
1:02:38
happy now when it came to Palestine um it had to begin with the
1:02:46
belief that we have more rights here than you do even though we can’t even prove that
1:02:54
we came hor for from here 2,000 years ago maybe some of us did maybe didn’t some of us didn’t but inherently because
1:03:01
we’re Jews we have more rights in fact we even have to pretend that you don’t
1:03:07
exist so the slogan a land without a people for a people with the land as if
1:03:13
there was nobody there and that meant that the people who were there became
1:03:20
nobodies and this is only being exacerbated and deepened and darkened as
1:03:26
the occupation takes further hold so that there was a poll done in
1:03:31
Israel this is reported in today’s New York Times Israeli posters would ask um
1:03:38
their populations about um the importance of resolving the Palestinian
1:03:45
issue over the decades and uh what they found was that uh in these
1:03:52
polls almost every other issue was more important than the Palestinian
1:03:58
one I’m talking prior to October the 7th he says um this is Israeli pollsters
1:04:05
they asked the respondents to rank issues in order of importance it didn’t matter how many choices the pollsters
1:04:12
presented she said resolving the Israeli Palestinian conflict came in last in
1:04:18
almost all the measurements it was totally ignored in Israeli public opinion prior to October the 7
1:04:26
s so that that whole people and what was going on to them just a few miles away
1:04:34
right disappeared as an issue of importance well that’s racism that’s that that’s sort of um
1:04:42
evaporating the essence of the other so that they don’t even exist in your mind and how do you and I’m not blame
1:04:50
and I’m not blaming Israeli individuals among they’re very great ones they’re very brave ones the very courageous ones
1:04:57
and even the ones who are not are just unconscious I’m talking about that’s how that system works we’re talking about
1:05:03
systemic effects we’re not talking about individual evil we’re talking about a system that evaporates the essence of
1:05:09
the other but the system has also penetrated the individual because we see
1:05:15
that hardening of humanity that cruelty that brutality that individuals
1:05:21
Express um yeah yeah but it’s that what is it that creates that evil it looks
1:05:29
like evil that is embodied an individual body it’s an well I think
1:05:36
it’s a social political Dynamic and people are all over the world are very much fairly passive recipients of what
1:05:43
comes at them so that um um in February
1:05:49
the polls in Israel showed that something like 9 94% of Israelis thought
1:05:55
that what the Army was doing in Gaza was appropriate or maybe not even enough and
1:06:02
this is after the deaths of 10 thousands of CH of thousands of children uh but
1:06:07
you know what that’s a universal phenomena it’s Universal if you look at
1:06:15
the United States um or Canada where you and I are speaking from um if you have a TV
1:06:24
discussion of say what kind of parties Travis Kelce
1:06:29
and Taylor Swift go to and did they kiss each other or not you’re going to get millions of people
1:06:35
watching discuss discuss something really important like climate very few
1:06:42
people will watch so I don’t want to blame them too much I don’t want to put blame on individuals these are systemic
1:06:48
issues they manifest individuals but they’re absolutely systemic and how much
1:06:54
of De is the suppression we are taught to suppress our feelings so the system
1:06:59
can continue because if you feel on a human level we will see what’s we seeing
1:07:05
now with the global rising of the students so how much from a trauma lens
1:07:11
that is fed by frozenness or suppressing our
1:07:17
Humanity well yeah so in in my book The Myth of normal that that you know very
1:07:23
well we have a chapter on the a social character and the social character is the character that this culture
1:07:29
inculcates in us and the way they would have us be and one of the features of the social character is that
1:07:36
disconnection from emotion and a and a passivity COR yes so it it takes
1:07:42
especially sensitive individuals um or sensitized individuals
1:07:49
to actually take part in a demonstration to
1:07:55
challenge their families to stand up for what to believe is right but most people are not to not a fault of their own but
1:08:02
they’re made into passive and rather indifferent observers of the
1:08:09
world which is also part of the design of the of the capitalist project keep you always in struggling and in fear and
1:08:17
that completely disconnect you from trying to think about me individually and disconnect from the it’s not even a
1:08:25
design as it’s not like somebody sat down and designed it it’s that every system knows how to prepare a system is
1:08:32
a self-organizing machine that knows how to perpetuate itself so it’s built in
1:08:38
and it’s encouraged but it’s not like somebody has to sit there and design it it’ll automatically work this way that’s
1:08:45
what makes it so powerful Jamie pen you’ve been so yamie
1:08:52
you have been so patient you are the first person with the hand up we want to bring you
1:08:59
in on you muted can you hear me yes okay
1:09:04
thank you um I feel like I’m gonna ask a similar question as I did with um Rabbi
1:09:09
Lynn Gabel firstly I appreciate everything think you do I see
1:09:15
you I sit here and I observe myself as I hear this and I’ll keep this short I promise the one thing that strikes me is
1:09:21
I don’t think we as a popul population as a species know what solidarity means because the
1:09:28
question I posed is what made Palestine the moral litness test because when we
1:09:35
started to fight for Palestine and please know that I asked this question as a teacher forever student with Grace
1:09:41
loving compassions but I know that when we started to fight for the liberation of
1:09:46
Palestine we’d have a few thought leaders that I respect say what about Congo and San now please understand that
1:09:52
I’m just speaking as part of the mass Consciousness this isn’t just mind but I know I’m part of it how can we learn
1:09:59
true solidarity if we know there are going to be a people that say that I didn’t get
1:10:05
this support from the world when we were going through XY Z and yeah I be to know
1:10:11
your thoughts I think what about the Congo and Sudan Dar
1:10:18
for Syria Iraq the ogers
1:10:26
those are fair questions those are fair questions and when you look at them
1:10:33
overall whatever is happening in those individual countries are manifestations
1:10:38
of the same globalized capitalism system that Palestine also represents so those
1:10:44
are her questions I’ll tell you my personal answer to it here in North America I
1:10:51
don’t see massive propaganda in favor of genocide and are
1:10:56
for I don’t see massive propaganda supporting starvation in the Sudan or anywhere
1:11:04
else I don’t see the politicians lining up enthusiastically sending
1:11:10
weapons and I don’t see the media writing articles every day justifying it
1:11:16
so I’m if I’m engaged in a
1:11:21
uh struggle to bring tooth to the question of pal it’s not because I value Palestine higher than I value some other
1:11:28
place in the world but because the system in which I exist is so doggedly and so determinedly
1:11:37
and so persistently and perniciously lying about what’s happening in Palestine and justifying it
1:11:46
so that I’m not fighting for the truth over there I’m fighting for the truth over
1:11:53
here and in that sense as Angela pointed out Palestine is a Lous test for the
1:11:58
whole world but that whole world also includes Sudan also includes other places it’s all one yeah thank you thank
1:12:08
you so much you want to read question that came before the event how can I as
1:12:14
an Israeli resist this horrible reality without feeling so much shame that
1:12:20
weakens me from being active leor alperin you are okay well I would say to
1:12:27
you first of all um why are you feeling shame you’re not doing
1:12:34
anything it’s being done in your name but you’re very fibrous rebel
1:12:42
against it so any shame that you have drop it
1:12:48
you don’t deserve it and it’s very hard for me to tell you
1:12:55
what to do because if I speak out as the way I’m doing I might get a lot of
1:13:01
people calling me names but I’m not going to lose my job I’m not goingon to
1:13:06
lose my friends because I don’t have friends who who argue the other way I
1:13:11
just have want much to do with them but in Israel you’re part of a community in
1:13:17
a system that’s very much organized to keep you quiet and to punish you if
1:13:22
you’re not quiet I’m not here to tell you what to do but there are others in Israel who feel the same way join with
1:13:30
them don’t make yourself alone and yes you ought to feel some
1:13:37
responsibility not in a sense of guilt but in a sense that I can take some
1:13:42
responsibility here join with others who feel the same way decide together what
1:13:48
under the circumstances that you’re facing you can do can you visit the West Bank and offer
1:13:54
some words of support can you witness the deputations
1:14:00
of the settlers and tell your communities about it can you join with
1:14:05
others in various organizations can you join stand together and at least dialogue with
1:14:11
Palestinians who are also mourning can you do all
1:14:16
that so I’m not here to tell you what to do but I’m telling you drop the shame
1:14:21
drop the guilt and take whatever responsibility you
1:14:29
can Maria Maria bring
1:14:35
Maria hello can you hear me yes wonderful uh Dr Gabor mate I just
1:14:43
want to take an opportunity to extend my eternal gratitude toward you and Angela
1:14:49
for all that you’ve done and the advancement of the collective Consciousness and healing um I’m really
1:14:55
curious about this idea of uniting over the struggle of the Palestinian people
1:15:01
and the implications that can have to continue to perpetuate that which we do not want to see rather than unification
1:15:08
over themes of resiliency and Liberation and I would just love to
1:15:15
hear your take on this because I have a desire to be more masterful in
1:15:21
envisioning that what we want versus that which we don’t want how that actually influences what we’re
1:15:27
witnessing and what’s unfolding right now Maria I heard your words but
1:15:35
I the actual question didn’t emerge for me can you make it in one sentence what are you asking
1:15:46
me sorry they needed to unmute me so the question is what are your thoughts over
1:15:52
the understanding of unifying with struggle rather than unifying in an
1:15:59
Envision of what we want which would be
1:16:06
Liberation what I’m not quite getting what contradiction you see I mean it seems to me unifying and joining if by
1:16:15
unifying you mean joining others in struggle that is the pathway towards Liberation so that the it’s not a
1:16:23
question of envisioning beautiful F Futures and uh wonderful outcomes of
1:16:29
what we’d like to see it’s a question of what can we do right now to join in the struggle with those others who have the
1:16:34
same aspirations and the same ideal so I think
1:16:40
U the question although it seems to see two separate things I think it’s
1:16:47
one so you joining in unity and
1:16:53
participation is the way to Envision the future thank you thank you thank you
1:17:01
Maria want to read another question to what extent can we begin to heal trauma
1:17:07
in the midst of a crisis like Gaza or can we only begin the work of healing the root of the cycles of violence after
1:17:16
people reach relative physical safety if the answer if the question has
1:17:23
to do with what do we do to heal trauma in Gaza right now oh my God nothing
1:17:29
people are being traumatized freshly every day their lives are in their lives hang by a
1:17:36
thread every day I hear about somebody who knows somebody who died his whole family was wiped
1:17:44
out all we can do is the best we can do is to support them
1:17:49
morally and materially if we can but trauma healing will have to
1:17:56
happen later the trauma that does need to be healed in this process is our own
1:18:01
because let me tell you personally whatever I think of this issue and whatever my opinions are
1:18:08
sometimes I can react to the same issues from a traumatized place and then I’m not very
1:18:16
effective so and the more I can calm myself and
1:18:23
get grounded and um come from a a healed Place Within
1:18:30
Myself the more effective my words and speaking and actions can be so those of
1:18:35
us that have the luxury of working on our traumas shouldn’t wait till this is over to
1:18:42
address them because in the lack of that our work itself will be undermined by
1:18:47
our lack of Consciousness and you can only be conscious when you’re healed over there I wouldn’t presume to
1:18:55
tell them how to heal their traumas in the midst of this unspeakable suffering and and and
1:19:02
threat thank you thank you yeah one question uh why do you think
1:19:09
Psychotherapy professionals registration bodies and organizations have been
1:19:15
silent and have not called for ceasefire how do you explain
1:19:21
this it’s not unique to psych therapy organizations I mentioned yesterday I
1:19:27
mentioned earlier today sorry about Dr Adnan Al brush who was the head of orthopedic surgery at alaa hospital I
1:19:37
think he was arrested in the middle of an operation they took him they beat him
1:19:43
they tort tortured him to death not a word of it from any medical
1:19:50
association that I know around the world imagine if the Russian had taken a
1:19:56
Ukrainian order to be surgeon out of the operating theater tortured them to death what the outrage would be when a part of
1:20:03
the American Medical Association so it’s not unique to
1:20:11
the to psychotherapists and and psychologists uh this silence the
1:20:19
silence is almost [Music] Universal it has to do with I think a
1:20:25
number of factors one is that a large number of psychotherapists
1:20:32
psychoanalysts psychiatrists Physicians are
1:20:38
Jewish and um my Jewish colleagues for whose work I have a lot
1:20:45
of respect from whom I’ve learned a lot and who has so much to give the
1:20:50
world I think on this issue very often conflicted to say the
1:20:56
least or hostages to Zionist ideology and a kind of fearful inability to see
1:21:05
the other point of view so they’re silent and their
1:21:11
colleagues are silent number one number two um it’s not
1:21:17
just the Jewish issue and I’m talking about really good people here for who I have a lot of
1:21:23
respect is not just a Jewish issue it’s also an issue of the overall
1:21:31
culture and in this culture with the exception of these two New York Times articles that Angela and I talked about
1:21:38
that appear just in the last two days the information that people have been getting has been for decades completely
1:21:45
one-sided so they have no framework with which within which to understand what’s going
1:21:52
on so it’s um and thirdly when I began to speak on this
1:21:59
issue by the way that’s nothing new for me I’ve been doing it for decades but but for some people it turns out to be a
1:22:07
surprise that I should talk about these issues in the last several months I get all these messages we’re not following
1:22:13
you anymore uh you’ve totally lost your credibility um all your work means
1:22:20
nothing uh you’re self-hating Jew uh you’re a capo a capo is was a Nazi
1:22:27
collaborator people are afraid of getting all that stuff thrown at them I don’t blame them it’s not particularly
1:22:33
Pleasant um not that it stops me but you know um but uh there’s a price to be
1:22:42
paid so if you’re a therapist or a spiritual leader I know a spiritual leader I’m not going to mention their
1:22:49
name but they have been forthright with their followers
1:22:54
they’ve lost followers people have been following them for decades because of the depth
1:23:00
and the inspiration of their spiritual guidance and the wisdom that they’ve imparted into the world and all of a
1:23:07
sudden all that doesn’t matter because you’ve spoken out on this issue
1:23:13
you’re disappeared from my Consciousness and so people are just
1:23:20
intimidated and finally on OP ptic level people are losing their jobs over
1:23:26
this you know if you can if you make a speech justifying the killing of tens
1:23:33
and thousands of Palestinian children you will never lose your job but if you make a speech or sign a
1:23:43
statement deploring that same killing you might be at risk for losing your
1:23:50
job so I’m not judging anybody for not speaking out I’m saying those are the factors that uh play into it and with
1:23:57
that I myself have to bring my participation here to a close thanking
1:24:02
you all and I could answer more questions but um I have to go get
1:24:08
haircut oh priorities thank you so much gab and thank you for for leading us
1:24:14
also You’ve Been instrumental in our own journey of waking up to this reality and taking us with you to the West Bank and
1:24:22
seeing ourselves firsthand the reality there because it’s one thing to read it’s another thing to see it and be
1:24:28
there and and and you’ve lost a lot of followers too haven’t you 50,000 just
1:24:34
50,000 it’s okay there’s no any other way we are getting way more because at
1:24:41
least we have people that we feel Comfort we have a community that we can trust you know and we can okay see you
1:24:47
guys soon thank you everyone so sorry we couldn’t address all the questions but
1:24:53
we’ll continue these conversations and create more space to meet so thank you
1:24:59
everybody just the film will be released on June 6 through June 27 it will be
1:25:06
available on our website so you can watch it directly by donation by donation and each donation that we
1:25:13
receive we’re going to plant an olive tree in the occupied West Bank and hopefully in Gaza so each one of the
1:25:20
donation and and and also will support Qatar is a trauma work for for your
1:25:27
children yeah the West Gaza yeah so please help us spread this message help
1:25:34
us spread the movie where olive trees weep is the website and thank you for
1:25:40
being here today thank you thank you thank you
oooooo
